hello...wife of a newbie - - Page 3Being diagnosed with prostate cancer

User

Posted 03 Feb 2015 at 13:57

It is Sue, but put against the statistic that 70% of men in their 70s and 80% of men in their 80s will have prostate cancer (whether diagnosed or not) the familial link becomes almost laughable. The greatest risk factor for PCa is being a man, closely followed by getting older. The genetics and environmental factor debate is, I think, much more significant when looking at families where the women and men are diagnosed at an unusually young age. John was dx at 50 but his dad was nearly 80 and there is no history of breast cancer or PCa in the family - I can't accept that there was a gene at play here and would much prefer to think it was about where or how John lived his early life (although it does worry me that it is my fault - the dreadful diet I fed him for years and all that microwave cooking before we knew any better).

Mo, I really wish now that I had enrolled on the course - has there been anything on genetic predisposition? Is it that some male families are more likely to be affected by the environment than others?

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User

Posted 03 Feb 2015 at 14:20

Hi Lyn,

I must admit it's strange that many men have prostate cancer which may never become an issue...the consultant the other day told Alan that for every three men on active surveillance with low grade prostate cancer, only one of those would end up needing treatment at some point.

In my adult oncology course lectures, the causes of cancer were often said to be a number of factors. Simply put, (they said) cancer cells are our normal cells that have gone off the original template. Our cells reproduce and split themselves faithfully, following the original cell's blue print. However, a range of factors (genetic, environmental and social) keep tampering with the some of our cells, and the photocopying gets less and less like the original over time. Those cells become cancer cells.

When I worked in breast cancer care, the consultant would sometimes suggest genetic testing, if we had a young patient diagnosed, with no family history. Some of that was to do with genes that haven't been discovered yet, it's all in it's infancy at the moment. By young though, I mean late teens/early twenties...

Cancer Research UK say that 'If you have more than one first degree relative diagnosed with prostate cancer (at any age) your risk is about 4 times that of the general population'. That still only accounts for a small percentage of the total prostate cancer cases, though, so age and being male, as you rightly said, are the biggest risk factors!

I may have to lie down after all this thinking...

Sue x

User

Posted 03 Feb 2015 at 14:58

Trevor has 1 full sister , 5 half brothers and 3 half sisters this story is going to get a bit complicated so you need to concentrate. 3 of the half brothers have died of pca. Trevor making 4 out of 6 male children to have pca. (that we know of)

Brother no 1 and the eldest of the children was born and raised in Jamaica his mother was Jamaican.

Trevor's Dad then emigrated to England and married Trevor's Mum , Trevor's Mum was Jamaican she arrived in England the year before his Dad , Trevor and his sister were born in Nottingham , they moved to London when Trevor was around 4, soon after this his Dad divorced his Mum and left.

Brother no 2 was born in England but the new family emigrated to America when he was around 2 years old , this Mum was white (so the children where mixed race.

Brother no 3 , Trevor's Dad never hung about very long so he had divorced wife no 2 and married wife no 3 she was from Canada and was of Chinese descent , emigrated to Sweden . This is where brother no 3 was born.

So all from different Country's with different mothers, I can't see environment being a link to any of them . Trevor's Dad didn't really hang around long enough to have an influence on diet.

The eldest brother was the one that lived the longest , mid seventies the others are younger than Trevor so would have been in there late 50s to early 60s.

Trevor's Dad some how ended up in a nursing home in Kent , he died of a stroke alone with no family around him he was 62.

I will leave you all to draw your own conclusions to this story, but certainly food for thought.

BFN

Julie X

NEVER LAUGH AT A LIVE DRAGON

User

Posted 03 Feb 2015 at 15:20

Hi Julie...

I always smile at the photo of Trevor...he look's a nice guy.

His Dad has produced a complex family tree, and a high incidence of prostate cancer within the family. As you so rightly say, food for thought. Sounds sad, but possibly predictable that Trevor's dad was eventually on his own....

Thank you for joining in this interesting discussion....I can feel more reading up going to be necessary:) (by me)

Sue x

User

Posted 03 Feb 2015 at 15:55

Hi everyone,

A very interesting post. Unfortunately I am still very worried about our son who had a grandfather and father diagnosed with PCa, also a paternal grandmother with breast cancer. My only hope is he ate a mainly healthy diet because I wanted to lose weight. He tries to exercise/keep his weight down. Loved the thought that the main risk for Pca is being male,sorry Lynn, but it made me chuckle. Phew Julie how do you keep up with Trevors relatives- tho perhaps you can visit a lot?! Back to reality -perhaps our son should take out private insurance just in case? Brain overload coming on..

Edited by member 03 Feb 2015 at 15:56 | Reason: Not specified

User

Posted 03 Feb 2015 at 15:59

Prof Ros Eeles of the ICR and the Royal Marsden is a leading researcher on BRCA-mutation carriers and prostate cancer. She is currently leading an international trial on determining if regular screening of men with BRAC1 and BRAC2 mutations will lead to earlier diagnosis of aggresive prostate cancer (IMPACT study). She also has another study running to investigative if family profiling can help in predicting prostate cancer risk. (PROFILE study).

I completed a questionnaire for the PROFILE study but I am not sure if I proved much useful information as many of the questions concerned the health and causes of death of my extended family (grandparents, parents, siblings, aunts and uncles). As I am over 70 all of my grandparents, parents and aunts and uncles are long since gone and my knowledge of any illnesses they may have had was limited in the extreme.

Information on Ros Eeles and the studies can be found here

Edited by member 03 Feb 2015 at 16:02 | Reason: Not specified

User

Posted 03 Feb 2015 at 18:50

Julie, I guess your computer screen is not wide enough for a family tree?

Amended risk factor list:
1. Being a man
2. Getting older
3. Being of African-Caribbean descent
4. Having close relatives who had early onset PCa or BCa (genetics or predisposition to external causes??)
5. Riding a bicycle (there is no reliable research to support this one so I am basing it on members of this forum disclosing on an old thread)
6. Work related to chemicals, oil, flying, engines (as above)
7. Eating lots of processed meats, dairy and ready meals as a young man (Jane Plant & PCR-UK)

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User

Posted 03 Feb 2015 at 20:58

Laughing at the only true ' have to be' when Mick was too sick to go to his appointment with lovely Dr B at the PCa clinic, he asked if I could go along instead, man did I get some funny looks!! When I told Dr B he got all embarrassed as he just hadn't thought about that one, Bless him.

The university of Bath course covered all aspects on the molecular genetics of PCa as well as some interesting discussions on environmental issues and diet. It was well worth doing and talking to others who did it a few years before me it is thoroughly updated every time it is run with any new information from research.

Mandy Mo

User

Posted 03 Feb 2015 at 21:51

Very interesting thread this one.

Lyn - I have 4 brothers and the diversity of what we ate and what we did in our spare time is amazing! I also guess the riding the bike link is simply because riding a bike is linked to an elevated PSA so when a cyclist has a routine PSA test their PSA is likely to be above normal and therefore they are more likely to be sent for a biopsy.

The chemicals possibility is an interesting one for me as I have 'messed' with so mush nasty stuff in my interesting and varied career. As there is no hereditary link at all for me (at least detected link) I would be interested in any evidence of the chemicals link, especially a link to any particular chemical(s).

User

Posted 04 Feb 2015 at 00:13

My father's dad got to 70 when he couldn''t pee, so had his prostate removed in an emergency op. He belonged to a generation where men ignored and didn't talk about their health issues. I don't know whether it was cancerous or not - probably not as he died of a heart attack 7 years later.

My dad (now 86) has had prostate issues since his 60's, and is now on hormone treatment, which is currently bringing down his PSA.

My dad and and I moved away from the area where my grandad lived when my dad was 30 and I was 8. There is a possible environmental link here.

This info doesn't prove anything, but I would suggest that there is a genetic link in my family. I am aware that my 2 daughters now have a higher than average chance of developing breast cancer, but there is none known on either side of my family.

Oh, and of course, Lyn, my dad, grandad and I are all male!

Paul

Stay Calm And Carry On.

User

Posted 04 Feb 2015 at 00:24

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

I also guess the riding the bike link is simply because riding a bike is linked to an elevated PSA so when a cyclist has a routine PSA test their PSA is likely to be above normal and therefore they are more likely to be sent for a biopsy.

No, it is based on a thread on here some time ago where some of us put up details of previous employment, hobbies, etc to see what commonalities there might be. A significant proportion were keen cyclists but then again how many boys don't have a bike at some time in their lives? We have quite a few pilots amongst us, a lot of motorcyclists and engineers, and a fair few who had had vasectomies. Other than that, the interests and employment histories were as broad as you would imagine.

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User

Posted 04 Feb 2015 at 08:30

I forgot - I've had the snips as well.

Paul

Stay Calm And Carry On.

User

Posted 04 Feb 2015 at 08:59

Hi,

Me too Paul. I did see the report about the possible connection between that and PCa. Does make you think but there again you're always looking for the answer to that question "Why me?".

Steve

User

Posted 04 Feb 2015 at 09:34

As did John. 40+ years ago

We can't control the winds - but we can adjust our sails

User

Posted 04 Feb 2015 at 09:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

There can still be link to more men who cycle being sent for a biopsy:

"9th March 2012 - Many doctors are unaware that keen cyclists can have raised levels of a protein which is an important indicator for detecting prostate cancer, says a leading consultant urologist.

A failure to check whether patients spend long spells in the saddle is resulting in otherwise healthy men being sent for uncomfortable and unnecessary biopsies.

Consultant urologist Christopher Eden, of the Royal Surrey County Hospital in Guildford tells BootsWebMD: "If you're a keen, competitive cyclist, or you're a recreational cyclist who commutes, the trauma of your perineum - which is the bit of you that you sit on - against the saddle is going to massage or injure your prostate in a minor way and cause inflammation, and the inflammation will drive up the PSA."

Cycling must be so good for you in so many other ways they do need to do more research ASAP otherwise some men may stop cycling through fear of getting PCa.

I guess I am just unlucky then as I don't ride, haven't had the snip, have no relations who have been diagnosed with it, not African-Caribbean, never ate lots of processed food and (despite what my kids think) I am not old. I must confess to scratching my testicles a few times when they have been itchy ....... it's a wonderful feeling. Any link?

Oh .... and I am a man.

User

Posted 04 Feb 2015 at 11:20

Hello, this is a very interesting conversation. I know you all know a lot more about prostate cancer than I do, especially as it is all new to us. When my other half found in a routine blood test that his psa was raised last June (we found it had been tested over the last 10 years without his knowledge in routine bloods) We went to see a urologist who said at 3.7 it was not really high, but suggested a biopsy as his father had prostate cancer, though he was diagnosed in his mid seventies, never had any treatment and died at 93 due to his parkinsons. Also his mother died of ovarian cancer, the urologist said there is also a link in sons with a mother diagnosed with ovarian cancer (diagnosed at 79, after chemo she made another 10 years before it returned, she died very soon after) anyway the urologist said he was fairly sure it would be prostate cancer due to family history. The biopsy showed early prostate cancer.

Yet the Brachy specialist sad that as his parents were fairly old they had to die of something and there may not be a link. When my other after half went to see one of our gp's last week due to not being able to cope with some of the side effects of his brachy, the gp was a different one but one he has been friends with for years said he can't believe how many people are being diagnosed with prostate cancer, he also told him never to ride a bicycle again as he feels there is a link. (he only rides a bicycle occasionally when we take the boys out up the road and back and sometimes he visits local farmers) he has now decided not to ride it again!

As for diet he always ate well as a child, no processed food. But we have 3 boys, the youngest is 5 and I can't cope with his eating habbits, he does not eat any fruit, any veg, any meat apart from sausages and chicken nuggets. I would give anything to change his eating. Especially knowing his father has been diagnosed with prostate cancer in his 50's so I feel he should eat healthy now.

Also I thought I would add that he doesn't smoke, rarely drinks alcohol and hasn't had the snip either.

Edited by member 04 Feb 2015 at 18:15 | Reason: Not specified

User

Posted 04 Feb 2015 at 11:59

Hi all,

This conversation and debate is so interesting, and mirrors many of the conversations I've had with people in my work. 'Why me?' does crop up a lot, understandably. On hearing today's revised statistics that one in two of us will develop a cancer in our lifetime (BBC news), it seems 50% of people may be asking that question.

It is probably an accumulation of factors that trigger the cancer response for prostate cancer...I've read that certain types of plastics, agricultural fertilisers, and diesel fumes can all contribute...and how many men will have lifetime exposure to those factors? Back to my original 'photocopying error' analogy....there may a slight genetic hiccup, followed by exposure to certain chemicals, the bike riding, vasectomy (although the jury is still out on that one), high animal fats diet, low vitamin D...you name it. As Sjtb so rightly says, we possibly have to be making the changes and prevention of risk factors at a young age..and that's exactly when we're at our most stubborn, and probably wouldn't respond to advice:)

Sue

User

Posted 04 Feb 2015 at 12:08

Interesting thread - I have often wondered about my husband and link to previous employment - he worked with dye

pigments and there is a link between that and bladder cancers

User

Posted 04 Feb 2015 at 12:14

Hi, just thought would say whiterose that my other half is a farmer so is always spraying the fields with fertilisers and various pesticides, I am sure none of these are good for his health, not forgetting many of these pesticides end up in our food, our crops do not go for human food but the cattle eat the hay, straw and barley, then the cattle go to slaughter for humans to eat, so it gets into the food chain. It would be interesting to see a study of people that have followed a strict organic diet too.

Edited by member 04 Feb 2015 at 12:15 | Reason: Not specified

User

Posted 04 Feb 2015 at 12:56

Thanks tombryce for your post. It will be worth watching the results of this.

My OH was diagnosed on his 66th birthday so just outside the parameters,his father was diagnosed when 80 and lived til 96.

I guess many of us had a fairly high dairy diet as little was known about this years ago. In fact my mother in law added butter to the OH s porridge so he would be strong!! He grew to be a six footer with a love of food,now struggling to keep his weight down as a result of HT.

El.

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