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Is my husbands cancer back

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 09:28

Hi all

i am new to this site so a bit nervous. My husband was diagnosed last year with prostate cancer at age 66 with a PSA of 12 and a Gleason score of 7. In August last year he had a radical robotic assisted prostatectomy at UCLH.

they told us they had removed the cancer and he would not require any further treatment. He has been having his three monthly PSA checks and they gave all been undetectable. Yesterday we attended and his PSA has risen and is now 0.1. Really worried now another test in 3 months

 

Edited by member 21 Aug 2019 at 10:11  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 09:28

Hi all

i am new to this site so a bit nervous. My husband was diagnosed last year with prostate cancer at age 66 with a PSA of 12 and a Gleason score of 7. In August last year he had a radical robotic assisted prostatectomy at UCLH.

they told us they had removed the cancer and he would not require any further treatment. He has been having his three monthly PSA checks and they gave all been undetectable. Yesterday we attended and his PSA has risen and is now 0.1. Really worried now another test in 3 months

 

Edited by member 21 Aug 2019 at 10:11  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 14:40
You really need to double check the result isn't <0.1 and I would be inclined to get it retested right away.

I can't think of any reason (apart from incompetence) that a PC nurse would state that a detectable result using the standard test is not significant .

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 19:16

Thank you so much for your advice. I am a real coward when it comes to my family and I feel so useless and unable to help. I’m trying to be cheerful and upbeat because I don’t want him to worry.

thanks so much for giving me something positive to hang on to

Best wishes

User
Posted 26 Aug 2019 at 03:18
Hey, Sleepy Steenie,

I am in much the same boat as your husband, T3a WITH lymph node involvement - click on my profile for more info - my hospital only tests down to 0.1 anyway, and so my PSA has been undetectable post-op for fifteen months.

The forecast is that I have a 98% chance of surviving for fifteen years, whereas if I had lung, pancreatic or liver cancer that percentage would probably be zero. Unfortunately, all cancers are called ‘cancer’ despite there being rakes of different ones, some many times more insidious than others.

I can honestly say I have not lost a moment’s sleep over my diagnosis as I realised there are much worse afflictions to suffer from.

I suggest you stop worrying and go bye-byes.

Best of luck and night-night.

Cheers, John.

User
Posted 26 Aug 2019 at 15:21

Hi Chris

thank you so much for your response what a great attitude. Sorry that your outcome wasn’t better but your so positive and living life to the full and not letting anything phase you.

if only you could bottle it you’d make a fortune.

only new to this site and I have  been so overwhelmed by the advice and support that I have received from kind people like yourself that have so  generously shared their stories.

I am truly humbled by it all. Thank you. I wish you well for the future and God Bless.

Jan

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User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 11:34

S

Is this reading actually 0.1 or is it a less than 0.1. I am at a hospital that tests to two decimal points, many only do the test to one decimal point, in which case the less than symbol is quite significant.

Thanks Chris

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 11:39

Hi Chris

thank you for your reply. We have the test at the same hospital every time and it’s usually under the 0.1 This time it has risen slightly to 0.1

the clinic nurse didn’t seem too concerned but I’m really frantic and worried that it’s not being checked again for three months.

in fact she wanted to leave it fir six months but because I asked for it to be checked sooner she agreed to three months. She didn’t give us a clue as to why it would have gone up which is a worry. Thanks

 

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 14:36
There are other possibilities as well as cancer cells that can cause PSA to increase/fluctuate. A good idea to have a couple of PSA tests at 3 monthly intervals to help establish if this is a trend. It will also perhaps offer some assurance to hubby and to you because six months would cause a lot of anxiety, even if there is no cause.
Barry
User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 14:40
You really need to double check the result isn't <0.1 and I would be inclined to get it retested right away.

I can't think of any reason (apart from incompetence) that a PC nurse would state that a detectable result using the standard test is not significant .

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 14:41

Dear Barry

thank you for your reply. I do tend to panic I’ve always been a worrier and it’s so hard because I feel really helpless as there’s nothing that I can do to help the situation.

i don’t know how I could cope with waiting for six months so the nurse eventually gave in and agreed to a three month test.

then I felt guilty for being a nuisance and making a fuss. Thanks for your advice

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 14:48

It was definitely 0.1 she showed us it on the screen. Apparently this is the upper limit of being considered undetectable.

she said if it reaches 0.2 they will have to start checking into it with scans etc.

i think it’s all just so everyday for nurses they see it all the time so it’s all  very matter of fact to them. I’m not suggesting they don’t care I just don’t think they appreciate how  we feel on the other end. It’s all very vague and non specific, it could be this, it might be that but don’t think about it or worry about it, if only.

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 19:00

0.1 is detectable but the official threshold for biochemical recurrence is 0.2 or three successive rises above 0.1 so your husband isn’t yet at the point where the NHS would say “yes, it’s back and so more treatment is needed.” As hard as it is, you will need to wait for the next PSA readings in 3 and then perhaps 6 months - assuming it goes up each time, you should be referred to an oncologist to discuss next steps. Having the tests earlier than 3 months won’t bring you to an oncology referral any earlier - they will still wait for the successive rises or 0.2. There is some good news though: because his PSA went undetectable and then started rising, this is a strong indicator that there are just some active cancer cells left behind in the prostate bed, which can be mopped up with some radiotherapy and hormones. If the cancer had spread elsewhere (like his bones) his PSA wouldn’t have been undetectable for the last 12 months.

Edited by member 21 Aug 2019 at 19:02  | Reason: Not specified

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 19:16

Thank you so much for your advice. I am a real coward when it comes to my family and I feel so useless and unable to help. I’m trying to be cheerful and upbeat because I don’t want him to worry.

thanks so much for giving me something positive to hang on to

Best wishes

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 19:48
I suspect you ar3 far stronger than you are giving yourself credit for.

My husband’s PSA was undetectable for a while but then began to rise. He didn’t really want to believe he needed more treatment so waited 2 years until the PSA was over 0.15 before he accepted the inevitable RT/HT. Since then, he has had 7 years of undetectable or only just detectable PSA. In fact, a couple of years ago his PSA went up to 0.11 and we thought we had another recurrence but happily, it went back to undetectable without any intervention.

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 19:53
Good evening Steenie,

12/05/13 Catheter out

12/06/13 Clear margins 0.003

25/10/13 PSA result < 0.05

14/01/14 PSA result 27/01 < 0.05

17/04/14 PSA result 22/04 < 0.01

15/10/14 PSA result 17/10 0.1

24/03/15 PSA result 0.1

28/05/15 PSA result 29/05 0.1

21/08/15 PSA result 24/08 0.001

26/11/15 PSA result 0.1

05/08/16 PSA result 0.01

00/02/17 PSA result ??

06/09/17 0.01

31/01/18 PSA result 02/02 0.02

14/09/18 PSA result 02/02 0.03

27/02/19 PSA result 0.02

02/07/19 PSA result of 25/07 0.04

Whatever your nature, our nature and tendency to be concerned or worry or not, when PCa joins in, it changes things. I have posted my results since my RRP in May 2013. You will see a range of numbers.

When I was given 0.1 instead of 0.003 I was very worried. But then, the numbers settled down. Ish.

Over 6 years past RRP, I am on 6 monthly testing, due to my choice, and with the agreement of my splendid GP Practice. The PSA result is only as good as the DAY IT WAS TAKEN. 5 minutes after THAT sample was taken, cancerous cells may be running around your body, AND, do I want to wait a year for another test? NO.

I put it to my GP: give me 6 month testing, or deal with the increased stress and medication to help with that, higher blood pressure and the medication to deal with that, weight gain and the medication to deal with that, increased alcohol intake and the medication to deal with that, kidney disease and the medication to deal with that, liver disease and the medication to deal with that.

The head pressure needs to be considered.

I wish you both well.

dave

All we can do - is do all that we can.

So, do all you can to help yourself, then make the best of your time. :-)

I am the statistic.

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 19:58

Oh Lyn

Thank  you so much for sharing your story with me. You have been through a terrible time it must have been awful to see the level rising like that.

you have really helped me to get things in perspective and I feel I can actually breath easier.

i can’t tell you how much you have helped. I am so glad your husband is doing well and wish you both all the best. God bless

User
Posted 21 Aug 2019 at 20:04

Thank you so much for your reply Dave. Wow you’ve been up and down like tower bridge. What an emotional roller coaster.

im really amazed at how much variation there has been in your PSA.

your advice is really appreciated and I am glad that your GP has seen the sense in six monthly tests.

thank you so much

 God Bless

User
Posted 26 Aug 2019 at 02:08

Hi

since our visit to the nurse and the news of the PSA rise to 0.1 we received a copy of the letter that she sent to our GP. It said my husbands cancer was T3a Gleason score of 4+3 = 7 with clear margins and Nx. In other words the cancer was advanced and had come out of the prostate and the lymph nodes were not checked. I am so worried and we were never told these facts. When we saw the surgeon and were initially told that prostate cancer was present, we were told it was T2 and contained within the capsule with a Gleason score of 3+4 = 7. We were unaware that things had been so different after surgery. And as it was advanced why on earth haven’t they bothered to check the lymph nodes. I am now so worried that things are worse than we were aware and I don’t know who to speak to for advice. I really don’t have confidence in the medical team at all now, they will see hundreds if not thousands of men like my husband in their careers but I only have one husband our son only has one father. I’m really scared and just feel sick and I’m trying to be laid back for my husbands sake but here I am at silly o’clock and haven’t slept for a week.

 

User
Posted 26 Aug 2019 at 03:18
Hey, Sleepy Steenie,

I am in much the same boat as your husband, T3a WITH lymph node involvement - click on my profile for more info - my hospital only tests down to 0.1 anyway, and so my PSA has been undetectable post-op for fifteen months.

The forecast is that I have a 98% chance of surviving for fifteen years, whereas if I had lung, pancreatic or liver cancer that percentage would probably be zero. Unfortunately, all cancers are called ‘cancer’ despite there being rakes of different ones, some many times more insidious than others.

I can honestly say I have not lost a moment’s sleep over my diagnosis as I realised there are much worse afflictions to suffer from.

I suggest you stop worrying and go bye-byes.

Best of luck and night-night.

Cheers, John.

User
Posted 26 Aug 2019 at 03:26

Oh John

you are a wee diamond. I am so grateful to you for your kind reply. 

So sorry that your having to go through this as well and you are so positive e and upbeat you make me feel ashamed for being such a woos.

I can’t thank you enough for your advice and I will take it and try to look on things with more positivity.

Bless you

 

User
Posted 26 Aug 2019 at 03:28

Sorry John

Tried to sign it but not only a worrier but a techno numpty as well

Best wishes

Jan

User
Posted 26 Aug 2019 at 05:53
For more reassurance maybe click my picture and read my profile. After surgery which i detested side effects wise , I was classed as G9T4N1M0 with spread to lymph’s and post op psa 1.5 rising quickly to 2.4. That was over four years ago. What have I done about it ? Nothing. Many offers of RT but told unlikely to be curative path so have declined and opted for regular testing. My psa is well over 100 now but 8 scans haven’t found any spread anywhere. So I’ve been loving life and family and work and full sexual recovery and an holidaying a lot and generally enjoying life to the max. I eat drink and do what I like. I know it will catch up with me but I’ll deal with that then !
User
Posted 26 Aug 2019 at 07:03

Have a play with these well regarded prediction tools
https://www.mskcc.org/nomograms/prostate

They should provide some reassurance.

BUT don't be tempted to bury your head, as a minimum your team should have discussed your post op pathology and informed you that additional radio therapy MAY be required.

Now it may be that the consultation was overwhelming and you were not listening - I know from my own experience you tend to hear what you wsnt to hear! But be ready next time, read up about the various stages and treatments and ask questions and challenge the medical team so you can be fully informed and make decisions that are right for YOU.

User
Posted 26 Aug 2019 at 08:26

Thank you very much for your reply.  That’s good advice I’ll wrote a few questions down and      make sure that I pay attention to everything that say.

thank you 

User
Posted 26 Aug 2019 at 15:21

Hi Chris

thank you so much for your response what a great attitude. Sorry that your outcome wasn’t better but your so positive and living life to the full and not letting anything phase you.

if only you could bottle it you’d make a fortune.

only new to this site and I have  been so overwhelmed by the advice and support that I have received from kind people like yourself that have so  generously shared their stories.

I am truly humbled by it all. Thank you. I wish you well for the future and God Bless.

Jan

User
Posted 26 Aug 2019 at 21:58
Hi please don’t focus on the word advanced as that conjures up all kinds of thoughts. If he has any cancer cells left behind they are likely to be still in the prostate bed and can probably be dealt with. At the next appointment discuss possible salvage treatment. But it may be wise to see how the PSA behaves for a while longer.

Bri

User
Posted 26 Aug 2019 at 22:12

Many thanks Bri

I have to admit that I have fixated on that word advanced and imagined all sorts of scenarios.

you are right of course and I really do appreciate your sound advice. I am amazed at how knowledgeable you and others on this site are and I realise I am really really a bit naive about it all.

of course I’ve googled a hundred different sites all giving conflicting and really sometimes worrying advice and information even when I know I really shouldn’t have.

Thank you for your advice and your help.

Best wishes

Jan

User
Posted 27 Aug 2019 at 23:04

hi

Clear margins. Good news.  Mine was T3a. Worry is negative energy as I'm sure we all know.

Look at PSA regular testing  as a positive . It's a new chapter in your lives.  

 I've unsure why lymph were not sampled ? Perhaps others will post.  

At 1 Dec place, as others have posted 0.2 is likely to be the threshold value.   ie whether it's an advantage or not you will not see miniscule fluctuations.

 If you look at numerous profiles. ie those having surgery . ie no prostate. you can see expected values should recurrence happen. 

Edited by member 27 Aug 2019 at 23:06  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 27 Aug 2019 at 23:16
Where did you see the word ‘advanced’? Nothing in the diagnostics you have quoted suggests advanced disease. Focus on the fact that he had clear margins.

Some urologists do not remove any lymph nodes in keyhole RP. Some do, but only where there is a suspicion of node involvement. Others take a few, or loads ... the more nodes removed, the more chance of lymphodema later.

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 27 Aug 2019 at 23:16

Hi Robgsr

thank you for your reply, l agree worry is just a waste of time and I am trying hard to just put my concerns to the back of my mind.

As you say at least clear margins are a positive and I am trying to get a grip of myself. Unfortunately I’ve always been a glass half empty kind of person that worries incessantly.

I can’t tell you how much it’s helped, hearing  from you and the other kind people on here, that have taken the time and trouble to read my moan and offered support and advice.

Thanks  so much I really appreciate it.

User
Posted 27 Aug 2019 at 23:22

Hi

It was in the booklet that we were given when he was first diagnosed. It stated that “ a” referred to cancer that had come through the capsule and was no longer contained within the prostate.

It referred to it as “ locally advanced” to be honest I wish I hadn’t read all of the terminology. I know they like to give as much information as possible and I appreciate that just wish I hadn’t read it.

 
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