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Sugar and spice and all things nice

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User
Posted 17 Dec 2022 at 22:42

Hi 


I am contemplating a complete diet change to boost my treatment. I have banished the pint and I am contemplating adding meat and sugar to the list. 


I have an awful sweet tooth and I consume large quantities of sweet things, buns, cakes, chocolate. Usually in large quantities. 


To be frank, the sweets have increased since I banished the pint but I have heard that sugar feeds cancer. 


I would like to hear about any dietary tips.


 


 

Cooleymountain 

User
Posted 19 Dec 2022 at 02:09

This is an interesting report by Cancer Research UK. It needs to be read in full but here is an extract -
"Sugar and cancer


Cancer cells usually grow quickly, multiplying at a fast rate, which takes a lot of energy. This means they need lots of glucose. Cancer cells also need lots of other nutrients too, such as amino acids and fats; it’s not just sugar they crave.


Here’s where the myth that sugar fuels cancer was born: if cancer cells need lots of glucose, then cutting sugar out of our diet must help stop cancer growing, and could even stop it developing in the first place. Unfortunately, it’s not that simple. All our healthy cells need glucose too, and there’s no way of telling our bodies to let healthy cells have the glucose they need, but not give it to cancer cells.


There’s no evidence that following a “sugar-free” diet lowers the risk of getting cancer, or boosts the chances of surviving if you are diagnosed.


And following severely restricted diets with very low amounts of carbohydrate could damage health in the long term by eliminating foods that are good sources of fibre and vitamins.


This is particularly important for cancer patients, because some treatments can result in weight loss and put the body under a lot of stress. So poor nutrition from restrictive diets could also hamper recovery, or even be life-threatening." https://news.cancerresearchuk.org/2020/10/20/sugar-and-cancer-what-you-need-to-know/


When it comes to PCa, to help a person reduce his risk of PCa, he needs to either have had his testicles removed whilst a young boy as one eminent Professor stated or have been on the diet of one of the countries that have a low incidence of PCa. By the time you have PCa there is little you can do to improve your PCa situation. Of course it is sensible to eat a healthy diet which would include minimising intake of sugar and by exercising regularly.


Put simply, Cranberry juice has a calming effect on the bladder and is widely recommended.  It was one of the things I was asked to have by a bladder retraining clinic I attended many years ago and it helped at the time, although I stopped taking it years ago.


 


 


 


 

Edited by member 19 Dec 2022 at 02:19  | Reason: to highlight link

Barry
User
Posted 18 Dec 2022 at 00:36

I assume your diet is as it is because you like eating and drinking this way. I also assume that you will not get much pleasure from your new diet. The effect it will have on your chance of dieing from cancer will be minimal.


So rather than wearing a hair shirt, I would switch to a hedonistic diet and pack in as much fun as possible. Of course I wouldn't go as far as a diet so rich as to bring on an early death through gluttony, but I'd try and get close.

Dave

User
Posted 18 Dec 2022 at 02:19
I would be interested if you could link to where sugar encourages cancer as I don't think this is the case. However, sugar does result in weight gain and it is widely recommended to reduce intake of this directly or in things loaded with sugar, some of which it is hard to avoid as it is added as an ingredient by produce manufacturers.
Barry
User
Posted 18 Dec 2022 at 06:50
There is no evidence that changing your diet has any impact on the progress or recurrence of cancer. By all means eat a healthy diet, but don't cut out everything that you enjoy eating! Moderation is the key!

Best wishes,

Chris
User
Posted 18 Dec 2022 at 07:06

For the last three weeks, after my procedure, my diet has gone to hell in a handcart. I too have a very sweet/ beer tooth and I have been indulging in some “me” time.
I woke up this morning ( maybe I should write a blues number ) and decided enough is enough. I know it is the wrong time of year however everything in moderation is a good rule to live by, Quality of Life etc.
As we are on the subject of diet can someone please explain the benefits of cranberry juice.
Rgds
Dave

Edited by member 18 Dec 2022 at 07:07  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 18 Dec 2022 at 07:25
Sugar doesn't feed cancer but insulin does and carbohydrate (Inc sugar) causes type 2 diabetes. Type 2 diabetes results in your body becoming immune to insulin and hence having too much of it swilling round your body encouraging many types of cancer Inc prostate.

https://www.pcf.org/c/prostate-cancers-sweet-tooth/

Reducing carbs and sugar in your diet is probably the single biggest cancer and heart disease reduction measure you can make.

User
Posted 18 Dec 2022 at 23:54

That made me laugh Dave. I think I've had my fill over the years without (amazingly) ever becoming obese. I do like your perspective on life with PC.


Brendan

Cooleymountain 

User
Posted 20 Dec 2022 at 06:35
Lyn

You need a new cook book. There is no causal relationship established between Prostate cancer and red meat. There is a geographic link but that is more likely to be because of what is included NOT excluded from diet. The Japanese in particular eat a meat rich diet.

Regarding evidence of dietary changes impacting diagnosed and treated men here is some for zinc (red meat is a great source of zinc!):

https://www.practiceupdate.com/C/145632/56?elsca1=emc_enews_topic-alert

Recent publication and NOT based on flawed "food diary" studies.
User
Posted 24 Dec 2022 at 08:25
When I was diagnosed back in 2018 I asked the Specialist Nurse if I should change my diet. She said sugar is bad so that day I stopped putting sugar in tea, coffee and on my cereal.
Took a while to get used to it but I couldn't go back to sugar now.
Whether it's made any difference I don't know but not consuming loads of sugar must be a good thing.
User
Posted 24 Dec 2022 at 11:57
Haha Jim. I drink red and white wine as fast as I can make it. I think technically it’s preserving me. I best stay clear of the crematorium πŸ˜€
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User
Posted 18 Dec 2022 at 00:36

I assume your diet is as it is because you like eating and drinking this way. I also assume that you will not get much pleasure from your new diet. The effect it will have on your chance of dieing from cancer will be minimal.


So rather than wearing a hair shirt, I would switch to a hedonistic diet and pack in as much fun as possible. Of course I wouldn't go as far as a diet so rich as to bring on an early death through gluttony, but I'd try and get close.

Dave

User
Posted 18 Dec 2022 at 02:19
I would be interested if you could link to where sugar encourages cancer as I don't think this is the case. However, sugar does result in weight gain and it is widely recommended to reduce intake of this directly or in things loaded with sugar, some of which it is hard to avoid as it is added as an ingredient by produce manufacturers.
Barry
User
Posted 18 Dec 2022 at 06:50
There is no evidence that changing your diet has any impact on the progress or recurrence of cancer. By all means eat a healthy diet, but don't cut out everything that you enjoy eating! Moderation is the key!

Best wishes,

Chris
User
Posted 18 Dec 2022 at 07:06

For the last three weeks, after my procedure, my diet has gone to hell in a handcart. I too have a very sweet/ beer tooth and I have been indulging in some “me” time.
I woke up this morning ( maybe I should write a blues number ) and decided enough is enough. I know it is the wrong time of year however everything in moderation is a good rule to live by, Quality of Life etc.
As we are on the subject of diet can someone please explain the benefits of cranberry juice.
Rgds
Dave

Edited by member 18 Dec 2022 at 07:07  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 18 Dec 2022 at 07:25
Sugar doesn't feed cancer but insulin does and carbohydrate (Inc sugar) causes type 2 diabetes. Type 2 diabetes results in your body becoming immune to insulin and hence having too much of it swilling round your body encouraging many types of cancer Inc prostate.

https://www.pcf.org/c/prostate-cancers-sweet-tooth/

Reducing carbs and sugar in your diet is probably the single biggest cancer and heart disease reduction measure you can make.

User
Posted 18 Dec 2022 at 23:54

That made me laugh Dave. I think I've had my fill over the years without (amazingly) ever becoming obese. I do like your perspective on life with PC.


Brendan

Cooleymountain 

User
Posted 18 Dec 2022 at 23:56

Dear Barry. 


I think I heard it down the pub from talking to a chap like you who had strong opinions on things. On a serious note o think Jonathan has ably articulated where I was coming from.


Brendan.


 


 

Cooleymountain 

User
Posted 19 Dec 2022 at 00:03

Chris 


I beg to differ. Diet has a fundamental impact on health and wellbeing. Common sense would dictate that diet and exercise have a significant impact on physical and mental wellbeing. As I stated in a previous post, Jonathan has nailed it and I will be moderating all eating and drinking excesses to give me a fighting chance and moreover to help stave off any weight increase that may arise as a consequence of ADT.


Brendan


 


 

Cooleymountain 

User
Posted 19 Dec 2022 at 00:08

Dave 


Waking up in the morning is much better than the alternative. Cranberry is rich in Vitamin C and E and antioxidants. 


Brendan


 


 


 

Cooleymountain 

User
Posted 19 Dec 2022 at 00:12

Hi there 


That is a really helpful response and it is where I was coming from. 


That is quite some journey you are on. I wish you well and hope to hear from you again.


Brendan


 


 

Cooleymountain 

User
Posted 19 Dec 2022 at 02:09

This is an interesting report by Cancer Research UK. It needs to be read in full but here is an extract -
"Sugar and cancer


Cancer cells usually grow quickly, multiplying at a fast rate, which takes a lot of energy. This means they need lots of glucose. Cancer cells also need lots of other nutrients too, such as amino acids and fats; it’s not just sugar they crave.


Here’s where the myth that sugar fuels cancer was born: if cancer cells need lots of glucose, then cutting sugar out of our diet must help stop cancer growing, and could even stop it developing in the first place. Unfortunately, it’s not that simple. All our healthy cells need glucose too, and there’s no way of telling our bodies to let healthy cells have the glucose they need, but not give it to cancer cells.


There’s no evidence that following a “sugar-free” diet lowers the risk of getting cancer, or boosts the chances of surviving if you are diagnosed.


And following severely restricted diets with very low amounts of carbohydrate could damage health in the long term by eliminating foods that are good sources of fibre and vitamins.


This is particularly important for cancer patients, because some treatments can result in weight loss and put the body under a lot of stress. So poor nutrition from restrictive diets could also hamper recovery, or even be life-threatening." https://news.cancerresearchuk.org/2020/10/20/sugar-and-cancer-what-you-need-to-know/


When it comes to PCa, to help a person reduce his risk of PCa, he needs to either have had his testicles removed whilst a young boy as one eminent Professor stated or have been on the diet of one of the countries that have a low incidence of PCa. By the time you have PCa there is little you can do to improve your PCa situation. Of course it is sensible to eat a healthy diet which would include minimising intake of sugar and by exercising regularly.


Put simply, Cranberry juice has a calming effect on the bladder and is widely recommended.  It was one of the things I was asked to have by a bladder retraining clinic I attended many years ago and it helped at the time, although I stopped taking it years ago.


 


 


 


 

Edited by member 19 Dec 2022 at 02:19  | Reason: to highlight link

Barry
User
Posted 19 Dec 2022 at 17:32

Barry that article conflicts itself (sugar isn't bad but being fat is) and is out of touch with current approaches to managing Type 2 diabetes and obesity linked to it.


So as I said sugar doesn't feed cancer but T2 diabetes does increase your risk of both cancer and heart disease.


The best way to avoid T2 diabetes and some cases cure it is to avoid anything that spikes your blood sugar which is basically all carbs.


Most carb rich foods have little else of benefit that isn't better obtained from leafy veg or meat and if you don't run marathons you simply don't need all that energy.


 

User
Posted 19 Dec 2022 at 17:46

Barry thanks for the cranberry juice tip. Going to give this a try. My bladder is way too sensitive post op, and defo urinating too often during the night 4x. Tamsulosin makes me feel like I have a blocked nose so not willing to go back on that just yet.


Back to the question about diet, reduced my sugar intake. But only from a health point of view. Not over weight but wanted to keep my weight down pre op, not put weight on post op and aid my fitness recovery by keeping lean... It worked. 

User
Posted 20 Dec 2022 at 00:15

Current research suggests that the  meteoric rise of prostate cancer in men in South East Asia over the last twenty years has been ascribed to the adoption of a Western diet.


A diet much higher in meat, fat and sugar than the traditional diets of particularly China and Japan. Anyone familiar with these countries, as I have been for thirty years will have noticed the gradual change in body shape of the indigenous populations.


In several Chinese medical studies, it was established that men with a higher waist to hip ratio have a significantly higher risk of prostate cancer. Hsing et al "Our results suggest that serum insulin levels may influence the risk of prostate cancer in Chinese men.


The legendary stories of Japanese longevity are always prefaced by " it's due to their diet, they eat a lot of fish". Yes they do, but diet is as much about what you don't eat as about what you do eat. In the past their diet has avoided saturated fat, red meat and refined sugar. 


Westernisation has changed this dramatically. Japanese youth are becoming fat and men are developing more prostate, bowel and colorectal cancer.


I think it is also interesting to note that although Japanese men have traditionally lived into their 80s and 90s, well beyond their Western counterparts, they had not previously recorded high levels of prostate cancer in the past and this is despite other cancers being prevalent and indeed a cause of death of the old in Japan.


it is only since the adoption of a Western diet that prostate cancer has begun to become very common in China or Japan.


Rather like Dave, I don't have an O level in biology, so I won't be setting myself up as an expert or guru. Neither will I be giving out medical advice. However, now that I have prostate cancer, I do intend to take a leaf out of the traditional, not modern Japanese book. I will moderate my diet and  reduce my intake of red meat, refined sugar.and saturated fat. It's also about lifestyle again like the Japanese, I will take up more exercise.


I have no doubt that ADT can add fat to the midriff and in my tiny little mind, reducing this fat whilst a cancer rages within can only be good for me. This is not offered as advice but as a record of my choices on my journey.


Brendan 


 


 

Edited by member 22 Dec 2022 at 02:03  | Reason: Clarification

Cooleymountain 

User
Posted 20 Dec 2022 at 02:36
The links between prostate cancer and diet are well known and have been evidence in scientific research - as you observe with Japanese / East Asian men. However, the research indicates that the stage is set before a boy hits puberty - if we, as parents and grandparents, could remove red meat, dairy, processed foods from little boys' diets now, we would start to see a reduction in PCa cases in about 50 years time. I persuaded my son onto a prostate care diet more or less as soon as his dad was diagnosed and he still does much of it now (apart from too much dairy still) - I guess it becomes easier over time?

There is no evidence at all that diet can affect a man once he has been diagnosed, particularly if he has had or is having radical treatment. There is a little bit of research to indicate that a prostate healthy diet can slow the progression of advanced PCa though.

If interested in prostate healthy eating and proper EU / UK based research behind it, treat yourself to the prostate care cookbook from Prostate Cancer Research and available on Amazon
"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard
User
Posted 20 Dec 2022 at 06:35
Lyn

You need a new cook book. There is no causal relationship established between Prostate cancer and red meat. There is a geographic link but that is more likely to be because of what is included NOT excluded from diet. The Japanese in particular eat a meat rich diet.

Regarding evidence of dietary changes impacting diagnosed and treated men here is some for zinc (red meat is a great source of zinc!):

https://www.practiceupdate.com/C/145632/56?elsca1=emc_enews_topic-alert

Recent publication and NOT based on flawed "food diary" studies.
User
Posted 23 Dec 2022 at 23:17

Diet is as much about what you don't eat as about what you don't eat and anyone who thinks otherwise tell that to my vegan daughter.


As a point of information the Japanese were NOT eating large quantities of meat, sweets and saturated fats prior to the 80s when they embraced a Western diet. 


I have every intention of adapting my diet. Of course the cause of cancer will vary from individual to individual but since my diagnosis all three of my brother's, two older and one younger have had their PSA tested and none have an even slightly elevated PSA. 


Despite having a very well balanced diet at home with lots of fruit and veg, I have sadly spent decades in hotels, all too often choosing the red meat and the dessert option.


As for Lyn's assertion that the stage is set before a boy hits puberty. What abject nonsense! 

Cooleymountain 

User
Posted 24 Dec 2022 at 06:44

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member


Diet is as much about what you don't eat as about what you don't eat and anyone who thinks otherwise tell that to my vegan daughtet


As for Lyn's assertion that the stage is set before a boy hits puberty. What abject nonsense! 



Well if anybody can make sense of that first line they are doing better than me!


As regards regards Lyn's comment about being abject nonsence, the widely acknowledged  top Focal Urologist


in Europe is on record as saying that one of the ways a person can reduce his risk of having PCa is if he had his testicles removed as a young boy and talks about the high pitched Castrato singers but this seems a rarity these days.

Barry
User
Posted 24 Dec 2022 at 08:25
When I was diagnosed back in 2018 I asked the Specialist Nurse if I should change my diet. She said sugar is bad so that day I stopped putting sugar in tea, coffee and on my cereal.
Took a while to get used to it but I couldn't go back to sugar now.
Whether it's made any difference I don't know but not consuming loads of sugar must be a good thing.
User
Posted 24 Dec 2022 at 10:32

BAUS says the stage is set before a boy reaches adulthood 🀷‍♀️

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard
User
Posted 24 Dec 2022 at 11:44

Cranberry juice did not work for me doh! Last nights skin full of beer did wonders though, I will take that as a positive for me and our local pub.

User
Posted 24 Dec 2022 at 11:57
Haha Jim. I drink red and white wine as fast as I can make it. I think technically it’s preserving me. I best stay clear of the crematorium πŸ˜€
User
Posted 24 Dec 2022 at 14:54

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member
Haha Jim. I drink red and white wine as fast as I can make it. I think technically it’s preserving me. I best stay clear of the crematorium πŸ˜€


Brilliant Chris πŸ˜‚

 
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