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Diet guidelines

User
Posted 06 Jan 2024 at 12:48

Hello, what's to avoid? I see some reports condemning eggs, others saying they're ok. Some people say 'go vegan,' others say "go Keto" or "Carnivore" ...head spinning is the result for me, surfeit of contradict info. 

 

Cheese - correlation? 

Thanks for advice, especially with regard to eggs, as they're a MainStay of my diet. 

 

Note: Japanese are the #1 consumers of eggs on the planet, but very little dairy. Japan has among the lowest prostate cancer rates. Green tea, Miso, other fermented stuff. 

User
Posted 10 Mar 2024 at 21:05

As with any patient forum, you really need to hang around for a while to see who is giving useful info and who isn't. Anyone who uses the internet needs to understand critical thinking, verification of sources, etc. which isn't something many people first exposed to the internet in adulthood will have ever learned, unless you work in a science or research environment. (It is now taught in schools, but that's relatively recent.) Generally, incorrect info is corrected quite quickly here because there are a number of very expert patients, certainly better than most other forums I've been on. This poster has been posting her private theories for a while - a mixture of things she's read which are correct, but then misunderstanding how they apply (DHT is a great example, which has previously been explained, but she seemingly didn't understand). On the basis of this, she seems to have stopped her husband having hormone therapy and put him on watermellon/soya/etc instead, which is incredibly dangerous if he actually needs hormone therapy, and yes, it is dangerous if others read those posts and think there's any validity in them, which is why it's important to correct them. I think people may have given up correcting her because it just looks like you're picking on people, which she has already complained about. However, most here will know the reliability of those postings - you may have turned up just after those initial postings and the responses correcting them.

User
Posted 10 Mar 2024 at 23:57

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member
On the basis of this, she seems to have stopped her husband having hormone therapy and put him on watermellon/soya/etc instead, which is incredibly dangerous if he actually needs hormone therapy, and yes, it is dangerous if others read those posts and think there's any validity in them,

No reason to pull any punches AdyH1927, Lizzo's advice can be dangerous and even life threatening.

While there will often be differing opinions here, based on personal experience and many research papers, we are not "lovely people [sarcastic]"  for challenging Lizzo's google driven nonsense. We are people who have either gone through prostate cancer ourselves, or had people close to us suffer from it, so this isn't Facebook.

Jules

Edited by member 11 Mar 2024 at 00:36  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 11 Mar 2024 at 11:55

Dear all,

I'd like to give everyone a gentle reminder about the house rules for the community.

Our house rules are 'be supportive', 'be kind' and 'help us keep the community peaceful':

http://prostatecanceruk.org/get-support/using-the-online-community#house-rules

We don't want to start locking threads and issuing warnings to people about their behaviour so please can I ask for everyone to be considerate to each other and respect differing opinions.

Best wishes,
Carol

Digital Manager
Prostate Cancer UK

 

 

User
Posted 10 Mar 2024 at 18:28

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

Just to say since the posts I made in this conservation I have learnt  about the role  of DHT and prostate cancer 

They talk about testosterone being the cause of Pca  but it's DHT  - which is converted from testosterone by the enzyme 5alpha reductase - that is the culprit 

5alpha reductase increases when a man gets older  whereas testosterone decreases

Makes sense now - I couldn't figure out why older guys mainly got Pca when their testosterone is declining - they are making more DHT bc the 5alpha reductase is increasing 

Just check out how to reduce DHT if you need dietary guidelines to fight prostate cancer 

You could give up cows milk and have soya milk instead - an easy switch 

Have a large slice of watermelon every day 

Have flora vegan low fat marg a fabulous new product instead of butter

Have a desertspoon of flaxseed oil everyday 

Eat organic cucumber 

Rocket 

Lots of wild fish ie haddock cod 

I could go but like I said check out DHT and it's role in prostate cancer  

The other thing to bear in mind is heart health - a healthy heart means a healthy prostate  you mention your Dad has blocked arteries 

 

Look guys, I really am sorry for pushing this.  But, where are you getting this evidence from?  Where are the linked, peer-reviewed studies?  I am sure you all mean well, but I asked a few days ago for extra information and none has been forthcoming.  Instead, we have a post like the one above which adds more unqualified information that contradicts previous unqualified information.

A lot of people will be passively reading these forums, and a lot will take the advice at face value believing it will help them.  

What is the difference between organic cucumber and non-organic?  

You give off "this is a fact" vibes in your responses (which I am sure are well intentioned) - but please, when claiming you have found information that backs up a claim - LINK IN THE STUDY SO WE CAN SEE FOR OURSELVES.

It's dangerous.  It really is.

User
Posted 12 Mar 2024 at 00:50

Wow - I go away for a few days and all this happens!

Ady, if you are still reading, I agree with a lot of what you are saying. I regularly complain to the moderators or report posts when someone is giving unreliable or misleading information, and it is the reason that I will not engage in direct messages - all posts and responses should be published openly so that the cranks and trolls can be challenged.

In response to your specific question about diet and small boys - I have always been clear in my posts that there is no evidence that dietary changes in adult men will make any difference to getting prostate cancer, preventing recurrence when someone has had radical treatment. Many years ago, when I first joined this forum, a lot of the men were following the Jane Plant diet rigidly; it was often quoted because she was a doctor. In fact, she was not medically qualified but it didn't stop scared people from cutting out all manner of joys from their life. I tried to cut all red meat, dairy, etc out of my husband's diary but he cheated every time my back was turned so I gave up. It was when I asked the urologist about whether J was doing himself any harm by eating bacon sandwiches that he told us about the research on western diet and said the only thing that would have made a difference was cutting out meat & dairy before puberty. He pointed us to the main research sources.

If you are interested, look up the Prostate Cancer Research Foundation - they have been funding research on this since 2004 through Margaret Rayman of the University of Surrey. The research suggests as above - in addition, they suggest that some dietary changes might slow down the progression of advanced prostate cancer. PCRF has published a cook book which you can buy on Amazon - but they make the point that this is food for a healthy prostate, not for men with prostate cancer

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Healthy-Eating-Prostate-Association-Foundation/dp/1856268691 

 

Edited by member 12 Mar 2024 at 00:53  | Reason: to activate hyperlink

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 10:03
Let's be absolutely clear there are NO clinical trials that have proven any food to be good or bad for prostate cancer.

I developed a large T3A tumour on a vegetarian diet that used lots of tofu (a hormonally active product because it is unfermented soya).

Since I was treated for my cancer and nearly died from the resultant infection and subsequent divorce I follow a low carb regime that includes all meats and all non starchy fruit and vegetables, I only eat bread as a weekend treat. I find this works because I can enjoy life.

I can't say it has cured my persistent PSA but it HAS got me off all blood pressure medications and reduced my weight by 10kg and kept it off.

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 16:51

Correlation is not causation.

Dave

User
Posted 08 Jan 2024 at 09:38
Well I for one am going to enjoy meat and fermented dairy (cheese).

Eating soy crap like I did for 30 years before my diagnosis because of dietary rubbish funded by the Seventh Day Adventists deprived me of much culinary delight and enjoyment.

Avoid sugar like it's poison (it is!) And check out sugar consumption rates in Asia before you stick all the blame on red meat.

User
Posted 11 Mar 2024 at 13:32

I'm out. I do not think there's a place in this forum for anyone who chooses to advise against life saving treatment for prostate cancer.

Jules

Edited by member 11 Mar 2024 at 13:35  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 11 Mar 2024 at 15:05

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

As far as I am aware, no-one on this forum is medically qualified? However many are very knowledgeable regarding prostate cancer.

I like to see links attached to support serious posts.

As they say on most financial advice sites.

Do your own research.

Knowledgeable - yes.  But that is anecdotal - based on their own experiences, experiences of their relatives, and experiences that have been relayed here.  

"Do Your Own Research".  Absolutely.  That does not mean going to Google.  It means calling the fabulous nurses here, a GP, a consultant.  

Why not Google?  I've got access to all the scientific research and published papers I wanted to check, through Google. Googling isn't a problem, its  the reliability of the information it directs to that needs treating with care. In another conversation of yours, I posted a link to a reliable scientific source, which you found interesting. I found it by Googling.

As for relying on the knowledge of GPs and consultants, there have been numerous occasions where people on this forum, have had good reason to question the wisdom of medical professionals. Clinicians are not always as knowledgeable as you'd expect. 

 

 

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 14:52
The blood pressure link is most likely associated with obesity which is definitely associated with poor outcomes for every illness known to man.

Obesity (or rather metabolic disease and insulin resistance) is probably the driver for Asian and USA prostate cancer differences too. Following that logic it is sugar and starch that drive disease not dairy.

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 23:21

Absolutely, tofu is a mainstay in their diet, as well as soya. 

Looking back in time now I think that if I had known what was happening to me now I would have seriously curbed my intake of dairy over the past few decades. 

User
Posted 08 Jan 2024 at 00:42
Dairy isn't the only big issue for young prostates - it's red meat and processed food, neither of which are consumed in high volume in the far East or mediterranean.

There is some reliable research about diet & prostate cancer but essentially, the science suggests it is what a boy eats before he reaches adulthood that determines his future prostate health. There is some research to support the idea that diet can slow down the progression of advanced PCa but, as stated by others, diet isn't going to make an ounce of difference (in terms of the cancer cells) to men diagnosed and on a curative pathway. What dietary changes can do is make a man fitter, healthier and less vulnerable to other health issues that may be associated with cancer treatment.

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 10 Mar 2024 at 18:43
"You could give up cows milk and have soya milk instead - an easy switch

Have a large slice of watermelon every day

Have flora vegan low fat marg a fabulous new product instead of butter

Have a desertspoon of flaxseed oil everyday

Eat organic cucumber

Rocket

Lots of wild fish ie haddock cod "

OK, some questions

1) Where is the evidence that cow's milk causes prostate cancer? Man has been drinking it for centuries, and our intake is lower than 50 years ago. My grandad would "Drinka Pinta Milka Day". So would loads of people in his generation. But, prostate cancer incidences are now higher than they were 20-30 years ago.

2) I love watermelon. But, where is the evidence that this defeats or prevents Prostate Cancer. What about other melons?

3) Flora vegan low fat margerine makes sense for anyone trying to lose weight. But, as it is a new product, there will be no evidence that links it to preventing, staving off, or fighting Prostate Cancer

4) Flaxseed Oil. You guessed my question - where is the evidence?

5) Eat organic cucumber. Is non-organic dangerous? What is the difference. Please tell me.

6) Rocket - again, why this particular salad item? Why not lettuce, kale, avocados?

7) Wild fish - Again, point us to the studies.

All the above will form part of a healthy diet (as per NHS guidelines, plus guidelines offered around the world). But, you are dressing it up to sound like the answer, the holy grail. You are also, potentially, creating an environment where PCa sufferers may start blaming themselves for their dietary choices - choices that are mimicked by millions in the UK, Europe and US. If it was this easy, how come it is you (no disrespect) giving us the answers, and not the Health Industry?

Please consider carefully before posting advice that you dress up as definitive when it is anything but.

Not just you, but I think a few on this forum - including the amateur doctor who has me at an increased state of anxiety by claiming PCa will become a problem for me in 10 years. The same one who diagnosed that the Mexican chap who asked for help will need certain treatments even before he has had an MRI.

DANGEROUS FOLKS.

User
Posted 10 Mar 2024 at 23:09

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

Don't worry Andy62  I don't think AdyH1927 took any of my advice seriously his opinion of me seems to be as low as your opinion of me 

What a lovely bunch of people you all are 

 

 

I don't have a low opinion of you.  What I have asked is for you to link in the evidence that backs up your assertions.  I have done the same for Lyn Eyre here too, and also the poster who stated that PCa will be an issue for me in 10 years based on absolutely no scientific evidence at all.

My main concern is that some people will take your advice at face value and change the way they feel they should be treated.  That could, indirectly, lead to a poor prognosis for that person.  If that is your defnition of being "lovely" then at least show the evidence that backs it up.  Because I have unpicked your advice and asked further questions you think that I have a low opinion of you.  Of course I don't.  I don't know you.  But, I will not apologise for asking anyone to share their evidence here so that it can be discussed.  I also hope that your failure to provide links will serve as a red flag for anyone who is currently taking your unsubstantiated claims seriously.

Of course, you could correct a lot of that (and actually provide help to others) by posting links to the peer-reviewed journals and studies that categorically state that your claims are correct.

User
Posted 11 Mar 2024 at 10:14

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member
If this chauvinist bullying remark encouraging AdhyH1927 to lay into me for advocating rocket is allowed (or thanked) it sadly shows this site's values in a bad light

To be quite blunt Lizzo, this site would be better off without you.

Jules

User
Posted 11 Mar 2024 at 10:17
Quote:

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

 

No reason to pull any punches AdyH1927, Lizzo's advice can be dangerous and even life threatening.

While there will often be differing opinions here, based on personal experience and many research papers, we are not "lovely people [sarcastic]"  for challenging Lizzo's google driven nonsense. We are people who have either gone through prostate cancer ourselves, or had people close to us suffer from it, so this isn't Facebook.

Jules

If this chauvinist bullying  remark encouraging AdhyH1927  to lay into me for advocating rocket  is allowed (or thanked) it sadly shows this site's values in a bad light 

 

Lizzo, why are you saying I am a chauvinist?  I asked you a load of questions to back up your claims with actual studies.  There is nothing prejudicial about that - I am also looking at my diet to see if there are any ways in which I can adapt to protect myself in the future from any chronic disease.  I asked the nurses here directly (all of them ladies by the way) and they told me there isn't really any strong evidence to suggest certain foods cause PCa, and certain foods prevent it.  I followed this up with my GP (a young gentleman of Omani descent) who also said there is no strong evidence.

If you do have strong evidence, then please share the links because it could be very important and useful information.  It could also be that what you have read, and repeated, is not from a peer-reviewed scientific journal.

I do have concerns that passive observers on this forum will read what you say, take it at face value, and start blaming themselves for having a diet that contains a lot of dairy.  You need to add context if you are making bold claims.

I have also asked the same from Lyn Eyre about childhood diet and Prostate Cancer links.  For both of your posts, I also tried Googling to find where your information is coming from, and in neither case was I able to find peer-reviewed studies or recommendations based on studies.  That's not me accusing either of you of passing off incorrect information, and I am definitely not saying it is being done maliciously.  That is me asking for you both to share your links so that I can read them and make my own choices based on the evidence that you both have but do not share.

I have also asked a gentleman on here who told a Mexican chap that he has two treatment options of Prostatectomy or RT - despite the Mexican chap even having had an MRI - what his advice was based on.  This same gentleman told me that PCa will not be an issue for me for 10 years - i.e. I will get PCa in 10 years time.  Based on what?  I have no idea.

Just so that you know this isn't a "female" thing - I have taken advice from female nurses.  Just so you know it's not a possible racial thing, I have taken advice from a Middle-Eastern, Muslim doctor.  Just so that you know it is not an age thing, I have taken advice from a 70 year old Welsh nurse who has worked in this field for 50 years.

In all cases of them giving me advice they all did one thing in common.  They pointed me to, or sent me actual information.  

I appreciate you are going through your own battle right now, and I sincerely wish you well and hope everything goes well.  But, this board is read by hundreds of people - people who are worried about test results, people who are worried about treatments, people who are worried about their own prognoses.  I will say here, for those readers, that no two cases are the same.  That is the advice a female GP gave me when I told her my festering anxieties that were generated from well-meaning, but completely unbased, evidence I was given.  

I appreciate that you are trying to be helpful, but I just don't think the penny is going to drop with some folks on here that, even if the advice is well-meaning, if it is incorrect it can cause apprehension, self-blaming, self-diagnosing, self-treating.  It is irresponsible to give advice as if it is the answer to a problem when that advice is merely an opinion based on anecdotal evidence, self-belief evidence, conspiracy theory evidence (i.e. big Pharma).  The pen is mightier than the sword, but a peer-reviewed scientific journal is mightier than well-intentioned unqualified advice that is misinterpreted, or misunderstood by the author.

I cannot say it clearly enough.  This is being read by people in various states of their own journeys.  From people like me (elevated PSA, followed by normal PSA - now trying to find ways to improve my health, and my prostate health) - to people like the Mexican chap who has an elevated PSA but no MRI or DRE, to people who are undergoing treatment, or have received treatment.  We all, ALL, have a responsibility to make sure that we are supportive people in the same boat, rather than supportive, unqualified, amateur consultants. 

There's a reason why consultants are earning big money - they are clever, have studied for years.  It's also a reason why the wonderful nurses should also be earning big money.  They are worth their weight in gold.  As are those volunteers who donate their time, and emotional efforts, to helping people and relatives.

I have not once criticised you as a person.  I have, however, responded to advice you have given - asking for evidence to back it up.  As a result of that you think I am bullying you.  I just hope that, in the course of reading this thread, that people who are desperately looking for help and advice with diets do two things

1)  Take your advice with a pinch of salt until you provide evidence

2)  Take their concerns to the brilliant nurses on this site and/or their GP/Urologist/Oncologist.

All the people on this forum can legitimately do is share their own experiences.  Giving advice like "It's milk that's done it", or "It's childhood habits that done it", or "In 10 years you'll have it" needs to be backed up with actual science.  Until then it is anecdotary - well meaning yes, factual, not so much. 

Like I say, we all have a responsibility to not be giving advice as if it is completely factual, certainly not without links anyway.  

This is the NHS link to healthy eating:

https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/eat-well/how-to-eat-a-balanced-diet/eating-a-balanced-diet/

 

This is the USDA "My Plate" advice (Note - they say "About 90% of Americans do not get enough dairy. ") 

https://www.myplate.gov/eat-healthy/what-is-myplate

 

This is the , very extensive, Australian advice on Healthy eating

https://www.eatforhealth.gov.au/sites/default/files/2022-09/n55_australian_dietary_guidelines.pdf

 

The overall message from those three, English speaking, Governments is broadly the same.  

User
Posted 11 Mar 2024 at 17:28

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

As far as I am aware, no-one on this forum is medically qualified? However many are very knowledgeable regarding prostate cancer.

I like to see links attached to support serious posts.

As they say on most financial advice sites.

Do your own research.

Knowledgeable - yes.  But that is anecdotal - based on their own experiences, experiences of their relatives, and experiences that have been relayed here.  

"Do Your Own Research".  Absolutely.  That does not mean going to Google.  It means calling the fabulous nurses here, a GP, a consultant.  

Why not Google?  I've got access to all the scientific research and published papers I wanted to check, through Google. Googling isn't a problem, its  the reliability of the information it directs to that needs treating with care. In another conversation of yours, I posted a link to a reliable scientific source, which you found interesting. I found it by Googling.

As for relying on the knowledge of GPs and consultants, there have been numerous occasions where people on this forum, have had good reason to question the wisdom of medical professionals. Clinicians are not always as knowledgeable as you'd expect. 

 

 

What criteria do you place on a scientific paper that makes it credible to you?

I am finding that there are very good areas of this forum where people support each other, pass along their stories and explain what happened to them, pass along questions that a person needs to ask.  I am also finding there are some areas where posters are passing off medical judgments.  Somewhere along the way, some posters here have lost sight on the fact that this is a support network, not an amateur doctors and nurses network.

"Your father probably has PCa"

"You won't have a PCa issue for 10 years"

"You will have to have these treatments"

This is all advice given in the last two months about

1)  A Person who has not had an MRI scan,

2)  A person who had an elevated PSA and no referral to a Urologist

3)  A person who had an elevated PSA, no DRE and no MRI. 

 

This advice was given through a combination of Google, anecdotes, and just plain irresponsibility.  Unlike a GP, or a clinician, or a nurse who will have to answer for mis-information and mis-diagnoses, and who will have a complete process to follow - posters here can post whatever they like without any repercussions at all.  

I am not saying this afflicts all posters.  Many are incredible responsible and restrained when giving advice.  Others, though, are sometimes like a bull at the gates - itching to respond (for genuine reasons of kindness) without much consideration for what they have just advised.  Whilst GPs and clinicians are not infallible, neither are some of the more respected posters here.  When your car is broke, you take it to a garage.  When you have a medical concern, just ask the mechanic because he also posts on here as a self-appointed expert.

Like I say, and this is my last post on both this subject and this forum (because I am genuinely angry at the blase attitude to giving advice), to anyone who reads this.  Talk to your GP, talk to the nurses on this site.   That's where you will get the best advice.  Whilst clinicians are occassionally wrong, posters here are wrong a lot more often.  

I wish each and every one of you my sincerest, heart-felt best wishes for the future.  I hope the scientists continue to make breakthroughs in treatments, in monitoring techniques, and in understanding that - sometimes - no action is needed other than monitoring actions.  I suspect PCa cases will keep rising as more people get PSA tests - but how many will need intervention?  Hopefully an ever decreasing number.

Take care.

 

Ady

User
Posted 11 Mar 2024 at 21:32

Ady and Jules, I'll be sorry to see you leave. The more we have here the better.

I'm going to have a late super. A raw brown trout, organic cucumber, watermelon, and rocket sarnie, with vegan spread and drizzled with flaxseed oil. Washed down with a cold glass of soya milk.

Hmmmmm. Can't wait. 

Edited by member 11 Mar 2024 at 21:34  | Reason: Typo

User
Posted 12 Mar 2024 at 00:52

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member
I suspect this is in reference to me challenging unsubstantiated claims and misinformation - at no stage have I been inconsiderate to people, but I have challenged the information they are giving.

I don't think the moderator's post was aimed at you, Ady - I think it was a shot across the bow to those of us who are frustrated with Lizzo's snake oil posts. 

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

Show Most Thanked Posts
User
Posted 06 Jan 2024 at 20:00
Hi 26.2, I think a healthy balanced diet is the way to go, such as the Mediterranean diet. As you are very sporty its probably similar to what you follow already. Fish, white meat, veg, beans, nuts and not too much carbs as its often reported that on ADT it’s more easy to put on weight. I think eggs would be fine

The Japanese were historically supposedly lactose intolerant so didn’t drink milk. My teacher in Japan rarely eats cheese, only a small amount of meat, lots of fish and vegetables. Likes Nato – gloopy mung beans for breakfast. Whilst not so prevalent as in the west incidence of prostate cancer has almost doubled over the last 10 years in Japan. Who knows maybe because of more western diet influences.

User
Posted 06 Jan 2024 at 20:16

Thank you, Mike, noted with thanks. Yes, I think the increase in p.c. in Japan might be due to increase in Western diet. When Japanese move to USA, Brazil, etc their p.c. rates increase also. 

Are you studying Japanese? I enjoyed my time in Fukuoka in 2007, studying Japanese at the Genki Language school. Model country for me. Bikes everywhere, old school. Safe, civilized, courteous, model diet (mostly). Disciplined people, mostly. Ethics. 

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 09:29

 

There are studies suggesting milk drinkers are more prone to prostate cancer this was the case with my husband but he has switched to soya milk which I have been having for decades - the change has been quite easy 

Tofu is a superfood imo my husband has it in place of eggs for lunch he still has eggs maybe once or twice a week I buy organic tofu its cheap versatile and delicious 

The chinese eat eggs yes but they dont consume much milk  we in the West have milk puddings, custard and yoghurt whereas in China they have deserts made from soyabeans  I only buy soya custard now which along with soya milk  comes in a carton so no more plastic packaging 

Edited by member 07 Jan 2024 at 09:39  | Reason: Add more info

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 10:03
Let's be absolutely clear there are NO clinical trials that have proven any food to be good or bad for prostate cancer.

I developed a large T3A tumour on a vegetarian diet that used lots of tofu (a hormonally active product because it is unfermented soya).

Since I was treated for my cancer and nearly died from the resultant infection and subsequent divorce I follow a low carb regime that includes all meats and all non starchy fruit and vegetables, I only eat bread as a weekend treat. I find this works because I can enjoy life.

I can't say it has cured my persistent PSA but it HAS got me off all blood pressure medications and reduced my weight by 10kg and kept it off.

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 10:37

Thank you, food for thought. 

Based on both of your answers I think a reduction in dairy would be wise for me even though the jury is not out as one of the posters mentioned.

It's going to be a challenge because eggs has always been a MainStay of my diet up till now as well as cheese but I think cheese is  a no brainer that it is not good for us. You look at countries with the highest prostate rates in the world and they include Ireland and Sweden at the top of the list which are huge dairy countries.

 

Thank you.

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 10:56

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member
Let's be absolutely clear there are NO clinical trials that have proven any food to be good or bad for prostate cancer.

I developed a large T3A tumour on a vegetarian diet that used lots of tofu (a hormonally active product because it is unfermented soya).

Since I was treated for my cancer and nearly died from the resultant infection and subsequent divorce I follow a low carb regime that includes all meats and all non starchy fruit and vegetables, I only eat bread as a weekend treat. I find this works because I can enjoy life.

I can't say it has cured my persistent PSA but it HAS got me off all blood pressure medications and reduced my weight by 10kg and kept it off.

 

 

 

 

There is a definite link between high blood pressure and prostate cancer 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8855905/#:~:text=Results,%25%20CI%201.08%E2%80%931.69).

 

Edited by member 07 Jan 2024 at 10:59  | Reason: Add more info

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 14:52
The blood pressure link is most likely associated with obesity which is definitely associated with poor outcomes for every illness known to man.

Obesity (or rather metabolic disease and insulin resistance) is probably the driver for Asian and USA prostate cancer differences too. Following that logic it is sugar and starch that drive disease not dairy.

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 16:51

Correlation is not causation.

Dave

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 18:56

Interesting but I lived and worked in China for three years and also in Taiwan and South Korea and all those people are mostly rake thin despite consuming around 500 to 700 grams of rice each day. 

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 19:29

Btw I think there is a question mark hanging over cycling  and Prostste Cancer ?

Apparently there now exists a "prostate friendly " bycycle seat 

 

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 21:17
Same as a fanny friendly bike seat I believe.

Re rice 700g is fine if you are using the carbs. Unless you are doing manual labour or running marathons it will just get turned to fat.

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 21:27

Believe me, most of my students were rail thin and so were the teachers in the university I  taught at in China and they were all eating rice like there was no tomorrow and they stayed thin throughout life and one thing to mention is that Chinese people in general eat very little sugar. Meals in China are characterized by rice, around 200 grams per meal, loads of vegetables and small portions of meat, usually pork. Dessert, a piece of fruit, usually banana or apple. I lost a ton of weight in China after three years there and remembering how difficult it is to find cheese in China and that the Chinese do not eat cheese might have something to do with it. 

The grand mothers and grand fathers that I encountered in China were usually in great shape, compared to most I see in the UK.

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 23:09

What about tofu in China ?

User
Posted 07 Jan 2024 at 23:21

Absolutely, tofu is a mainstay in their diet, as well as soya. 

Looking back in time now I think that if I had known what was happening to me now I would have seriously curbed my intake of dairy over the past few decades. 

User
Posted 08 Jan 2024 at 00:42
Dairy isn't the only big issue for young prostates - it's red meat and processed food, neither of which are consumed in high volume in the far East or mediterranean.

There is some reliable research about diet & prostate cancer but essentially, the science suggests it is what a boy eats before he reaches adulthood that determines his future prostate health. There is some research to support the idea that diet can slow down the progression of advanced PCa but, as stated by others, diet isn't going to make an ounce of difference (in terms of the cancer cells) to men diagnosed and on a curative pathway. What dietary changes can do is make a man fitter, healthier and less vulnerable to other health issues that may be associated with cancer treatment.

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 08 Jan 2024 at 00:50

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

Btw I think there is a question mark hanging over cycling  and Prostste Cancer ?

Apparently there now exists a "prostate friendly " bycycle seat 

 

Indirectly, yes. Research with British Cycling and other European professional cycling teams showed that professional cyclists have higher 'normal' PSA readings than other men but are at no increased risk of developing prostate cancer. Having a PSA test within 4-6 hours of a long or hard bike ride can temporarily raise the PSA by about 10% so some men, particularly when monitoring their PSA very carefully to identify recurrence or disease progression may choose not to cycle immediately before their blood test. 

The main concern about cycling is whether it impedes erectile function recovery if a man gets back on his bike too soon after he has had nerve-sparing radical prostatectomy. That's where the prostate friendly saddle can come into its own.

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 08 Jan 2024 at 05:25

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member
Same as a fanny friendly bike seat I believe.

Ah! I always wondered what a menstrual cycle was.

User
Posted 08 Jan 2024 at 08:39

Quote: "There is some reliable research about diet & prostate cancer but essentially, the science suggests it is what a boy eats before he reaches adulthood that determines his future prostate health."

Interesting 🤔, and with this in mind I think that in western countries the possible link between diet and future prostate health is not addressed in terms of potential warnings with regard to diet. It seems to be a no brainer that Far Eastern diets in general tend to be protective of prostate cancer.

One of my Sikh friends who's in his 70s has a PSA below 1.0 which I find amazing. Like many Indians I think he's a vegetarian which may help as well. I also think he's of the type of vegetarians who do not even eat eggs but are allowed to eat butter and milk and their own type of butter which they call ghee. 

User
Posted 08 Jan 2024 at 09:38
Well I for one am going to enjoy meat and fermented dairy (cheese).

Eating soy crap like I did for 30 years before my diagnosis because of dietary rubbish funded by the Seventh Day Adventists deprived me of much culinary delight and enjoyment.

Avoid sugar like it's poison (it is!) And check out sugar consumption rates in Asia before you stick all the blame on red meat.

 
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