I'm interested in conversations about and I want to talk about
Know exactly what you want?
Show search

Notification

Error
12>

Radiation Rocky road - but could be a lot worse.

User
Posted 26 Mar 2023 at 20:03

Starting a new thread here since postings in other threads aren't really relevant anymore.
After my successful treatment with Cabazitaxel (managed 9 of the 10 cycles, and kinda wish I'd done the 10th, although PSA was rising, so probably not missed much there) I'm back where I've been so many times over the years.  The cancer becoming more agressive and my PSA rising alarmingly.  PSA 4214 on 2 March, and doubling time of 5-6 weeks. I doubt I'm going to follow this number any longer - what's the point?  Although a slow down, if only temporary would be a boost.

Was given chance to see the latest bone and CT scan images.  Tumor on right rib has dissapeared, but more tumors have appeared in pelvic bones - quite literally all over.  One in particular is larger than the others and pressing against nerves, sending pain down my right leg and up into my back.  I was given a one-off radiotherapy treatment to target this, but I've had so much radiation to that area already that there was a real limit as to how much I could have.  Not enough it turned out.  I could almost here the tumor laughing - "is that all you've got".   Ur-g-h-h.   Well actually, no, that's not all I've got.  A few weeks later I was given a second (last chance), and this time there didn't appear to be any holding back.  Not quite sure why the change of heart, but I'm up for any treatment that can help me, even if it is a rocky road - I'm not ready to give up yet.  It was a long day in hospital - the doctors fitting me in where ever they could, but I had to wait my turn and after many hours my unwelcome tumor got another dose of what was coming, and this time it didn't laugh - it screamed.  The journey home was a nightmare, and as I sat in the car in one of those emergency lay-bys on the M1 hurling into a barf-bag (always keep those handy) I fealt I had hit an all time low.  I barely got out of bed for the next few days - not that I got much sleep.  I just kept telling myself that this too shall pass, and that there has to be hope.

Rough days followed, but I finally got the pain meds sorted.  Fatigue and weakness are a daily fact of life, but I can manage without the walking stick now, and if there has been nerve damage, well I can still walk and move around well enough.  Although my quality of life has taken a tumble, really, what did I expect at this time.  It's a sobering thought though.  Like many in this situation I've tried to do stuff with the time I've still got, and Christmas/New Year saw me in Latin America.  In mid January I was wandering across some volcano at 4000m in the Andes above Quito.  No problem.  A few weeks later I'm limping into CT scanner suite, and shortly afterwards I need a walking stick for support.

Now approved for Radium 223 treatment, which should start in mid-April.  Stuff I've read is generally encouraging, and I'm hopeful it can buy more time - I could see in 2024 and maybe get to 5 years after diagnosis before I finally "wear out" (was originally given "months").  And if it does work, the extra time bought might see Lutetium become available on the NHS, so another potential plus.

 

Edited by member 27 Mar 2023 at 14:08  | Reason: additional detail

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 22:34

Thankyou everyone for your responses and good wishes.  Rocky road not quite to lonely now.  It's a strange road to be on, and nothing in my life has prepared me for it.  I'm guessing that most people using this forum have had their cancer diagnosed early enough for it to be treated successfully and then spend many years just keeping an eye on things in case the cancer reappears, so PSA scores are very low - no more than single figures, or even decimals.  So they get to ring the bell and have every reason to celebrate.  But for those of us who didn't catch it in time (even when I was diagnosed with locally advanced cancer I still didn't present any of the classic symptoms that would have raised the flag) it's a very different world.  My latest PSA score on 2 May was 10,233 which suggests it has returned to the doubling time of around 6 weeks.  So much for the slow down back in March.

I remember the oncologist talking with me on our first meeting, and explaining how the Hormone Treatment + Docataxel, followed by radiotherapy would sort the cancer out for a while, bringing my PSA right down, and keeping it there for, well maybe a year or more.  I'd be discharged from Weston Park and my GP could keep an eye on things.  Not quite how it worked out. 

My PSA did come down to 2 (from over 900), but even before the radiotherapy finished it was rising alarmingly.  So instead of being discharged I found myself in a revolving door going straight back into Weston Park and my new oncologist discussing whether I wanted to try Arbiritone or Enzalutamide.  I'd been looking forward to that year off treatment, but what can you do?  I chose Enzalutamide (because it's easier to manage - no timing issues through the day), and it worked for a while, but not as long as it might before PSA starting rocketing.  Then followed Cabazitaxel - they didn't do a very good job of selling this stuff - "life threatening chemotherapy" and it was put to me that I might prefer to just slide into palliative care?  Er, no.  I understand that some people have a nightmare of a time with it, but the reality for me was that it was much easier to manage than docataxel, and after 9 cycles of the stuff I was ready for the number 10 - no problem.  But the cancer had other ideas, and my PSA was already rising rapidly, so cycle 10 got cancelled.

All of this was punctuated with rounds of radiotherapy and periodically the tumors started wreeking havoc in my pelvis causing no end of pain and putting me out of action for a while.  But the radiotherapy always worked suprisingly well, and once I got it things improved usually within days.  Throughout this time (Aug 2019 - Jan 2023) I was able to lead a fairly normal life, and do the sort of stuff I wanted (like travel) given that I wasn't going to have a long retirement of 20 - 30 years, but a rather compressed one of maybe 2 - 3 years.  And I was only 58 (literally my Birthday) when I was diagnosed, so I hadn't even made it to retirement!

I was able to keep my fairly normal life going up until the end of January this year.  Then things started to go downhill rapidly.  From the end of COVID international travel restrictions back in November 2021 I'd spent as much time as I could travelling - often within Europe, but with long hauls to the Americas too.  It was amazing, but there was a real sense of "now or never", and at times trying to do too much.  The high point was my road-trip across the SW USA.  I picked up a rental at Las Vegas Airport and drove out across Nevada, stopped of at the Hover Dam, and then headed east across the Arizona Desert, picking up the interstate at Kingman and then heading up into the Arizona high-country.  The weather changed from warm sunshine to stormy - bright sunshine on the hills around me contrasted with jet black clouds ahead, and as I topped Coyote Pass the snow was really coming down.  Maybe I should have gone for the SUV 4WD upgrade after all?  But my very sporty and comfortable Sedan coped well enough, and got me to Williams by dusk.  As I pulled into the Motel car park I skided slightly on ice and the car miraculously slid almost perfectly into a parking spot outside what turned out to be my room.  "This is going to be the mother of all roadtrips" I thought to myself.  And so it was.  Looking back now I'm so greatful I did it, and had the chance to do it.  Ironically, if I'd never been diagnosed I'd probably never have done much of the long-haul stuff I managed - the money would have gone on paying bills and fixing the house.  But with no long-term to bother with, I could afford to spend money on living my dreams, and for a while at least have the sort of life I'd long wished for.  Eventually all dreams have to end, and maybe that's where I am now. 

It was a very unpleasant awakening, and I don't really recall much about February and March, except that I didn't get a single nights decent sleep, and relied increasingly on painkillers and loads of other meds to keep it all together.  I did at times question whether it was worth going on - my quality of life was zero, and if this was not going to improve much than it might be time to throw in the towel.  But that's not me, and no matter how rubbish it all got I believed that there was some chance that things would improve - the radiotherapy which at first wasn't on the table suddenly was, and then more of it.  A ray of hope to grasp.  April saw a slow - very slow but steady improvement and things have been, well not brilliant, but not bad either.  What can I expect? 

I had to understand that my life could never go back to what it was only a few months ago, and that everything now is different.  Travels - forget it.  The furthest I've been is Weston Park for consultations and treatment.  At the weekend I drove 4 miles to a local woodland and walked a 3 mile circuit before driving back.  That was the most adventurous thing I've done in nearly 4 months.  And I really enjoyed it.  Much of the time the pain makes any idea of driving a no no, but occassionally I get a repreve, and I'm confident about what I'm doing, but I never go far - Tesco or the Garden Centre, all within 10 minutes.  In the last week of the first Radium 223 cycle the pain seemed to almost vanish, so maybe it'll be the same this time and I'll get the chance to travel a little further.  I had a long talk with my GP about driving, and he was happy to let me take responsibility - afterall, I'm not stupid - however rubbish things might be at times now they'd be a hell of a lot worse if I had a car crash, so I'm not taking chances.

It's the accepting all this that's the real key to how I'm living and feeling at the moment.  In some ways it's easy.  There's loads of things I could do that I can't anymore, so forget them.  After the last few days my pain seemed to be easing and by today I had high hopes for going out somewhere maybe to one of the parks in Sheffield.  If I didn't feel up to driving then an Uber, or the train.  I slept well and very comfortably - none of the constant repositioning trying to find a pint where the pains not that noticeable.  Then I tried to get out of bed and all hell broke loose.  After two minutes trying to stand properly I had to lay back down.  The pain was unreal, despite having my Fentanyl patch and having taken 200mg of pregabalin an hour earlier.  A 400 microgram abstral slowed my heart rate and brought my breathing under control, but didn't make much difference to the pain.  After 30 minutes of trying to find a comfortable position to lay in I finally decided I needed to call this one in.  The fear of metastatic spinal compression haunts me, and this episode was a new one on me.  My doctor at the hospice talked at length about what was probably happening, and the only real solution it to increase the painkillers.

So I woke up with high hopes for the day, and it rapidly turned into a nightmare.  As the day went on the pain subsided, and by late afternoon I managed the walk to the pharmacy to get more pain meds.  Now, by evening I can walk OK, and sit down comfortably - that's another problem - when the pain ramps up I can't sit down as the pain shooting down my leg becomes unbearable.  Needless to say the pain meds leave me a bit drowsy.  So not the best of days.  But I staggered around my garden - so much in flower, and the promise of what's to come over the summer.  And I did a short walk across the fields and along a short ridge with views across Sheffield to the Peak District.  With the sun low in the sky and some lovely clouds it was worth seeing.  So actually, no such a bad day.

One thing I find difficult dealing with at the moment, and I guess there's no answer to this one.  I know that I'm approaching end-of life, but no one can say exactly when that might be.  Optimistically I might make it into 2024 and still be physically active, or it could be a matter of a few months - who knows.  Maybe the reason that my original post attracted so little attention is that those people who might have had something to add simply aren't around anymore.  As I wandered through my garden admiring the bluebells, azaleas and one rhododendron which has excelled itself this year, I can't help but think I'll never see this stuff happening again.  It's an uncomfotable thought, and it brings home the situation I'm in.  I don't know what the answer to this one is.  I guess to hope for the best, but be prepared for the worst.

 

User
Posted 16 Jun 2023 at 22:19

Whilst I've been in the Hospice several Medical Students have come to talk with me about my experience with cancer. I've gone through the medical history and how I ended up here, but also another side of it which I think is just as significant. This may sound odd or hard to figure but here goes.

 

The three and a half years between July 2019 when I was diagnosed and February 2023 were the best and happiest years of my life. It may sound strange, but I'll try to explain.

 

When I was diagnosed my GP signed me off work sort of indefinitely. I didn't want to waste another minute of my life in that crumby stressful unrewarding job where there was endless abuse and agro, and little support - I was in teaching... 'nuf said.

 

My financial situation changed overnight. My Pension pot was nowhere near enough to provide for a comfortable retirement if I were to live to a ripe old age, but this was off the cards and now 4 years was about it. Suddenly my pension pot looked very adequate.

 

I've always loved to travel, but time and money restrictions meant that I'd still not made it to so many of the places on my wall map that I'd highlighted. Now was the time to start really travelling.

 

And so I did - a little cautiously at first. I made it to California before the first round of Chemo started. Then COVID got in the way, and for the next two summers it was only possible to travel within the UK. So I did, extensively. When in November 2021 the USA lifted its' travel ban I took one of the first flights to Los Angeles and spent a month travelling around southern California, and on it went into 2022: Chile, South Africa, Iceland, Norway, Iceland (again!), Munich, Dubrovnik, Chamonix, USA, USA (again!), Hong Kong, Costa Rica and finally Ecuador. I took every opportunity to go places and kept it up until I returned from Ecuador in January 2023.

 

It was a bit crazy at times, but I sensed that time was not on my side. On the flights returning from Ecuador I was aware that things weren't right. Subsequent scans showed how far the cancer had spread. Since then the only travelling I've done has been to Hospital, and it's obvious I won't be going to anymore places. I wish I'd done more whilst I was able (hindsight, sigh...), but realistically it's hard to see how that would have worked.

 

In all these travels one moment sticks in my memory and perfectly exemplifies what it was all about. Last October I made it to Canon Beach on the Oregon coast. It's a place I've wanted to visit for over 20 years.

 

The long-term affects of all my treatments was taking its toll and fatigue/lack of energy was becoming a significant issue. To the north of Canon Beach is Ecola State Park - an area of forest and coastline with a number of walking trails leading to beaches and viewpoints you just have to see and savour. And so I did. On the Oregon Coast Trail from Ecola Point (from where you get the classic view of Canon Beach) to Indian Cove I found the going hard, so I parked myself on a tree stump to rest. After a minute I got my breath back and started to look around. I could glimpse the Pacific Ocean between the trees and hear the waves crashing on the shore below. I was surrounded by ferns on the forest floor along with fallen trees covered in moss and more ferns. Different types of moss were draping from the branches of all the standing trees. Above a clear blue sky and sunlight making it through the trees to light up the forest around me. It was so beautiful. I just sat there taking it all in. I really can't find the words to describe what I experienced in that moment, and there have been so many other such moments on my travels since July 2019.

 

If I'd not been diagnosed with cancer then I would never have been able to travel around the world, seen and experienced all the places I have, and had an amazing time doing it all. In all this time I've never felt sad, angry, unhappy or sorry for myself, or done the "why me" thing. Instead I embraced the situation, accepting it for what it was and whilst understanding all the negatives, looking for positives that were now possible. The positive was to be able to live the life I'd always wanted, if only for a limited time. I had no control over all the negative stuff - the cancer and everything that goes with it, but the positive - how I lived my life in the time left - I could control.

 

No matter how great a time I've had of it living the life I'd always wanted, it was a bittersweet experience. The reality of living with cancer was always there in the background and I always knew how the story would end. Eventually the time would come to pay the Piper. So here I am, lying on my very adjustable bed in the Hospice looking back on all that's been. Until February 2023 the cancer had been under control. There were times back in 2021 and 2022 when the going got tough for a while, but I always bounced back. Most of the time since diagnosis things have been fine, and I've lived the dream. For this I'm really grateful and consider myself very fortunate. It is these thoughts that I keep in my mind now and will in the coming days - whatever they bring.

Edited by member 16 Jun 2023 at 22:22  | Reason: formatting

User
Posted 22 May 2023 at 00:08

Tried a different approach this weekend.  If I am to see the course with this treatment then the pain control is what I have to focus on.  I've been kinda reluctant to take high dosages of painkillers - I had problems with morphine and its derivatives last year, and it was these problems that put me in hospital rather than the cancer!  But there's no choice now - I'm on different painkillers (fentanyl and abstral), and whilst they are still opiates (and very strong ones at that - 100 times the strenght of morphine) I seem to tolerate them better than morphine.  Spoke with one of the doctors at the hospice today and she put it so clearly and simply.  If you're in pain take the painkillers, and if it's not working then take more up to the daily limit - which is suprisingly high.  The main side effect is drowsiness, especially when I'm combining them with Pregabalin at its highest does, but again, I seem to be becoming tolerant of that - I've been up and about all weekend and was back in the car today for the short journey to a garden centre and then a little further to Morrisons, where the special offer on chocolate weetabix was too much to resist...  Oh dear, is this what my life has become?

Well maybe, but I've enjoyed the weekend - the weather has been wonderful and I've spent most of the time outside on short walks, a little driving and shopping, and a lot of time in the garden where stuff comes into flower every day.  I'm still adding plants for additional colour - it seems more important now than ever before - if this is my last summer I want it to be special. 

I'm a bit of a sucker for items that have been reduced to clear.  The garden centre had the usual collection of half dead "compost", but in and amongst this detritus I found a very healthy looking helebore at half price.  These plants are wonderful - they flower beautifully in the middle of winter right through into spring.  The label showed coral pink flowers.  It won't flower until January, and I might not be around in January.  Hmm. 

I bought it, took it home, potted it on into a larger pot, gave it a good alkali based feed and put it in a shady spot to get on with what plants do.  In early winter I'll move it to the shelf under my kitchen window, and as winter progresses it, and a few friends that also look good in winter will brighten every day when I look out at them.  I want to believe I will be around to see all this, and if I stop bothering doing stuff just because I'm on "death row" then it may become a self fulfilling profesy, and I won't be around to see anything.  It hit me as I was going through all this that one way or another I'm going to bulldoze my way forward for as long as I can, despite the recent setbacks.  It brings a smile to my face, even when I'm staggering around clumsily in the kitchen, exhaused at the end of the day, trying to make a cup of cocoa and not burn the toast.  It could be I'm just a bit high on the painkillers - but that's no bad thing, I think I've earned it.

User
Posted 07 Jun 2023 at 21:37

Hi Lyn. My GP very obligingly provided me with a DS1500 last October - looks now like he may be bang on. The benefits system was bewildering to me until I was contacted by Advocacy at Rotherham MBC. A very helpful lady took me through all the benefits I was entitled too, and better still actually did most of the applications for me. This included PIP. I was told to apply for Universal Credit which would give me access to another benefit, all of which I would get automatically. The lady who dealt with my case at the Job Centre couldn't have been more helpful - everything was dealt with in one visit, and as I left she assured me I'd never need to set foot in the place again.

The physio saw me today and we worked on going up and down stairs - much easier when I do it the right way. I'm walking more and now managing without the stick, at least when I'm indoors. My big fear when I go back home is falling when I'm outside, and having real difficulty getting up, especially if I'm on the pavement. The physio is going to take me through ways of coping with this. There's also talk of having someone to assist me when I'm out.

It's kind of Ironic - as I approach end-of-life, for the first time ever I have no monetary problems, and instead of getting old and neglected I will be well cared for until the end, probably at the age of 62 assuming I make it to the end of July, which I have every intention of doing! It will be four years since I was diagnosed by that mad Doctor who told me I had months to live, should put my house in order and that it was all part of God's plan for me... Huh, this one had to go.

The next Doctor I saw was a lot more down to earth and said with all the treatments available 4-5 years was a realistic outlook, and given how aggressive the cancer has behaved it turns out to have been a pretty accurate forecast.

Nothing in life can prepare a person for this, but I've got access to counselling from a qualified physcotherapist who is doing a great job of helping me work my way through this swamp.

So all round I couldn't have been more fortunate in getting the right support at just the right time. I think I have been very lucky.

I couldn't ask for more, well other than a cure, but let's be realistic...

Edited by member 07 Jun 2023 at 21:40  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 15:16

Hi Dean,  thank you for these posts.  I am in, i feel, a very similar position to you now.  I expect my PSA to be at least in the 2ks tomorrow when I see oncologist and am at 5 of 10 Docetaxel treatments.  Like yourself I have extensive bone mets and am on morphine and gabas at the moment as well as pa Ralvo patches for numbing some particulars areas (ribs especially as every rib had mets).  I am ok with the GABAs, but they do leave me a little space cadet like at times.  Morphine does the trick but dose is having to rise to keep up.  I find that my nurse from the hospice is the best person to talk to about pain and she bridges between oncology and GP.  Like yourself I have mets in the spine and it terrifies me.  I have been told that I may also be a candidate for radiation direct to bones so I am interested in your experience.  Also some possiblily of targeted genetic treatments but that is still to be determined. 

Look after yourself Dean and the best advice I have had from my hospice nurse is to go with the messages the body is sending, rest when needed and don’t accept pain, there is so much they can do to take it away so keep a record and keep asking for help.  

Again thanks for your posts which this afternoon been so helpful to me to see someone else who has a similar profile of PSA rise and spread and progression of the disease. Sending you best wishes. Sometimes I have felt I am the only one who is not able to keep this cancer at bay.   

Cheers

Michael 

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 19:31

Hi Mgfol68,

I'm sorry to hear how lonely your 'journey' feels at times and hope that sharing your feelings on here is of some help.

Best wishes,

JedSee.

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 21:46
Dean, the problem with R223 is that it doesn't really treat the prostate cancer but targets the bone nets to improve quality of life. Unfortunately for some men, it makes the bone pain worse instead of better and therefore defeats its own purpose. We have gad a dew men on here who have stopped R223 early - only you and your onco can decide whether it is improving your QoL or not.

As men come towards the palliative / end stage, it can be a delicate process to get pain meds balanced properly - enough to be fairly comfortable without being completely knocked out all the time. Generally speaking, the hospice nurses / pain clinic / palliative care team are much better at this than GPs or onco / urologists.

I am in awe of your resilience!

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 20 May 2023 at 00:25

Thanks everyone for your comments - it's a real boost to read this stuff.

Two weeks after the 2nd Radium 223 injection and I haven't quite got the pain meds sorted - it's a balancing act with those old style scales that bounce up and down for a while everytime something changes.  So it's 600mg of Pregabalin daily, + 37.5 microgram Fentanyl patch, 4mg of desamethosone, and 8 paracetamols.  I feel a bit spaced out (I'm chuckling as I write this) - can't thing why, but the pain seems manageable.  There are moments when it flares up pretty bad, but usually dies back down just as quickly.  I'm trying not to use the abstral too much as I need a really high dose to be effective and I don't want to overdo it.  Mobility is a bit issue, but like the pain it's difficult to find any pattern over the 4 week cycle.  Some days I can walk quite freely, and barely need the stick.  Other days I can't manage without the stick and I'm staggering about rather than walking.  The pain too is perplexing.  You'd think that it would be bad in the early stages of the cycle, and then slowly improve, but I've had days in the first week that have been almost pain free, followed by days when it definatley isn't pain free.  I'm hoping that by the end of the third week I'll get some real respite, like in cycle 1 and be able to "live" a little more.

I'd hoped to spend part of today going to the shops and a couple of nearby garden centres, then spending the rest of the day pottering around in the garden.  But the pain in my right leg meant no chance of driving - even just a few miles.  It's hard to figure - I can't sit down for even a minute during the mornings without a huge surge of pain, which I can only deal with by standing and wondering around.  Exercise like walking seems to help.  Later in the day something changes, and sitting down, and even driving becomes possible.  But it's so unpredictable. 

I guess I have to get used to this, and instead of making plans for what I'd like to do days in advance I need to wait and see what happens on the day.  This is so very different to the way I've been used to living.  But things have changed, and I need to change too - there's really no alternative, and moaning or complaining ain't going to help, so better get on with it.

Lyn - thanks for the links.  They were interesting reading.  Andy Ripley got almost 5 years of quality life after diagnosis and showed so well how to live well until the cancer finally took over.  He seemed to do well at getting on clinical trails.  Not the case for me - oncologist did mention some stuff, but I could tell from the way he was talking that is was just pie in the sky, so I never put any stock in the idea and now I've just forgotten about it.  If anything comes up I'll try it, but I'm not sitting by the phone waiting.  I fully understood what Nimeniton was talking about - these thoughts have been with me too, more so recently.  I know there is going to come a point (probably when metastatic spinal compression cripples me) when hope runs out and quality of life fall too low.  I've already decided that at such a point it's time to throw in the towel, check-out or however else you may put it.  The doctor from the Hospice has come out to see me a few times - on the last visit she commented that my lounge was plenty big enough for a hosptial bed!  Whilst the idea of a new bed with a comfortable mattress and all that adjustability at the push of buttons on a handset does hold some appeal, the reality would be that I'd be a prisoner in my own home, unable to move about, and completely reliant on other people to do everything for me.  That's not living, and in no version of my future could I put up with it.  So we can forget about the hospital bed in my lounge - I'll have to take matters into my own hands by that time...

Michael - don't get worked up about the PSA numbers.  I've just hit 10,000 and I just rolled my eyes when the doctor read it out.  It's like whatever is left of my cancer riddled prostate is spinning out of control and all it can do is produce evermore PSA - pretty useless organ I'd be well rid of.  I'm just curious as to how high it finally goes.  The specialist nurse at Weston Park told me PSA is a bit like smoke.  You can have a fire roaring away (like an aggressive cancer) and producing very little smoke, or conversley you can have a fire that's smouldering away producing loads of smoke but very little heat.  It's best not to try and read too much into these numbers - all my oncologists have told me this, and whilst I'm always curious to know what the latest score is I don't dwell on it.  In the early days I used to plot the figure on a piece of graph paper stuck on the side of my fridge.  I worked out if I tried to plot the numbers now I'd be in the attic.

Getting the Radiotherapy and Radium 223 was a real minefield for me.  At first, back in February I was told that neither would be on offer, because of - well reasons I can't now recall, and probably didn't understand at the time. But shortly afterwards, and after various scans and blood tests, and being transferred to a new oncologist I was given a low (way too low) dose of EBR - I was told I'd reached the limit for treating the particular area which was affected.  But, shortly after that there was a change in opinion, and I got a huge dose of EBR, and that really had an effect.  I never questioned any of this - just leaving it to the experts to decide what was best.  A few weeks later I saw the oncologist again, and we had a long conversation about where I was at, how difficult it was to predict what was going to happen next, the risk of further nerve damage and the chances of Radium 223 actually making any difference.  Chances were about 50/50 of it working for me.  If it did it could extend my life into next year.  if not it would just be an unpleasant experience I could have done without.  How did I feel about going into palliative care?  Hmm, been here before.  Palliative care to me means end-of-life, and I'm not ready to accept that - I simply feel in myself that this is not my time, and I still have a life that I'm continuing to live, and I'm happy with it, despite everything that's happened recently and the massive changes I've had to accept.  So, 50/50 - I've had far worse odds than that in the train wreck this is my life - bring on the Radium.  It's not been as easy as I hoped - by far the most difficult treatment I've had to cope with, but every problem has some sort of solution, and so it comes down to management, and not giving up. 

I'm not sure why I was initially told that I couldn't have Radium 223, or why the change of mind.  Unlike many others on this forum I'm not much good at actually understanding the detail I'm given - back at diagnosis, when I had the DRE / Biopsy I was told loads of stuff about how unusual my case was, and how the doctor who did the biopsy collected loads of extra samples (urgh - that biopsy went on forever - it fealt like a torture scene from Game of Thrones) and sent them off to different labs for analysis.  When I met the oncologist for the first time she had a huge folder on the desk, looked up at me and commented on the complexity and how it was "not textbook".  I never understood any of it.  Perhaps my way of dealing with the situation - I'll let the doctors deal with all that - they're the experts, and I am definately not.  It was also at this point that I decided two things.  Firstly, I'd fight the cancer with everything I was offered, and I wouldn't give up untill I was finally beaten into a quality of life that fell too low.  Secondly, I'd put my trust and faith in the doctors and medical staff - they have the knowledge and expertise, not me.  So their advice is what I follow.

I know what you mean when you talk about feeling strangely calm.  I get that a lot.  When people find out I have cancer they seem to get upset about it and start being sorry and getting a bit emotional.  I did when I was first told I had cancer.  A doctor I have (thankfully) never seen since told me quite bluntly on the 30 July 2019 (my 58th Birthday) I had advanced cancer, I wouldn't see out the year and should put my house in order, and get this - that this was Gods plan for me.  I kinda switched off a bit at this point, but I recall him going on a bit more about God.  The nurse sitting slightly behind him looked uncomfortable and embarased.  I left the room in a state of shock and spent the next 20 minutes staring out of the window on the stair well.  I drove home on auto-pilot and for the firt time in years even had a few tears - how could this be happening to me.  It kinda ruined my birthday among other things, but 24 hours later I'd found the strength from somewhere to start to deal with it.  I saw my GP later that day.  He looked at the reports and information and was baffled.  Even in the worst case senario it would take far more than a few months for the cancer to kill me, and when I mentioned the monologue about it being Gods work we both started laughing - I mean seriously the wrong wavelength!  Like I say, I've never seen that Doctor since.  The talk with my GP put me strangely at ease - we talked and were both quite upbeat about it, and it's been like that ever since.  The alternative is to fall into anger, self pity, and the "why me" mentality.  All of which are completely unhelpful.  So don't go there.  It is what it is and accepting this is the only way to go. 

I do recall how my life changed dramatically over just those few days.  I looked at what I was spending my time on, and how much was spent of stuff that really didn't matter.  So I stopped doing what seemed like loads of things that had been important, and now I realised weren't.  It was high-summer, and I went for long walks in the surrounding countryside - everything seemed a bit more real and in-touch, kinda hard to put into words.  I was signed off work, so I'd just get in the car and take off for a few days, or a week and go where ever I fealt I wanted to go - road trips (the answer to all problems).  It was a sureal time, and in a way it's continued ever since.  My life was turned upside down, so I went with the new flow, despite all the agro of having terminal cancer - I just started to move on in a new direction.

Now I've said this to people over the last nearly 4 years since diagnosis, and I don't think anybody has really understood, judging by the look on their faces.  These years have been amongst the best of my life.  I've looked at my life and how I was living and chucked out all stuff that really doesn't matter.  I'm more intouch with the nature around me and appreciate every day like I never did before.  I have been so fortunate to have a good medical team looking after me (my travels have taken me to many countries where someone like me would get no medical treatment at all - imagine how awful that must be).  I have been able to travel to places I only ever dreamt about and experienced things that have really made an impact on me, making my outlook on the world different and changing me as a person.  For all this I'm truley grateful.  It's ironic that all this has happened because I have cancer, and that my time on this Earth will be cut short... very short.  It's a bittersweet experince - on the one hand I've been able to live, for a few years at least, the kind of life I've wanted and indeed needed - on the other hand it's not going to last for long.  But even now, when things are starting to fall to pieces, I still feel generally happy and a little unconcerned about my situation.  Despite all the limitations I now have to cope with, when I wander out of the house on my frequent local walks I'm always smiling, and that's the way I want it until my time comes.

User
Posted 13 Jun 2023 at 23:49

Thanks for the comments. I hope that my experiences are useful to others.

Things have moved on rapidly since my last post. By late last week I was able to walk without the need for sticks and was looking forward to being discharged on Monday. But over the weekend my situation deteriorated quite dramatically - the pain and weakness in my thighs and hips rose and even walking with the sticks became difficult. It was hard to take in.  So I'm still in the Hospice, and not sure when I might be leaving.

The physio has got me a three wheeled walker, which makes a big difference to my mobility. She and the Occupational Health worker have made up a list of stuff I will need when I return home, and a care package has been proposed. For someone who has lived very independently it's going to take some adjusting to, but I'm coming to the realisation that my world has changed big time, so I have to change with it.

By the 2nd of May my PSA was up to 14 thousand and something, so no joy there. The Radium 223 was my last real hope in terms of treatment, but that was abandoned after only two cycles. So now I can only watch and experience what happens as the cancer progresses. Based on what's happened recently the outlook isn't good.

So the Rocky Radiation Road came to a sudden end, and now I'm in a very strange place.  I'm sat on a bed in a Hospice, with little idea of when I'll be leaving.  When I do get home my life will have been turned upside down. I think it's fair to assume that End of Life isn't far off, and that I'll probably not see out the summer. The time I still have will be affected by all my physical limitations. I won't be able to drive anywhere, and even if I could I'd be limited by what I could do when I got where I was going. Even with the walker I can only manage 5-10 minutes before pain and weakness leave me needing to lay down and rest.

So my travelling days are well and truly over and I think I'll be at home all the time. If I can find a way to keep up with the garden, and cope with the stairs then I think I'll be happy enough. I knew this time would come, but not so soon.

But here it is, so I'd better embrace the situation and get on with it - the clock is ticking, and there's still so many things I want to do.

Edited by member 14 Jun 2023 at 00:03  | Reason: additional info

User
Posted 15 Jun 2023 at 00:43
Oh Dean, I am so sorry to see this - and that the treatments have just not lasted out for you. Sometimes, younger men do seem to have a cancer which is so much more aggressive than normal. It is worth asking about Stilboestrol - considered an old-fashioned treatment nowadays s it is oestrogen-based but it does sometimes do the job that other HTs fail.

We are all willing you on - as an old friend on here used to say to other members when things were looking gloomy, "it's not over till the fat lady sings so we have locked her in the basement for you"

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 03 Jul 2023 at 20:22

Hi DeanA,

So sorry to hear that things have gone further downhill for you.  I hope that you are getting all the kindness, care and support that you need and deserve from both the professionals around you and from any personal friends and family that you might have.

I wish you peace and contentment, as I'm sure everyone on here does.

Take good care of yourself.

JedSee.

User
Posted 26 Mar 2023 at 20:03

Starting a new thread here since postings in other threads aren't really relevant anymore.
After my successful treatment with Cabazitaxel (managed 9 of the 10 cycles, and kinda wish I'd done the 10th, although PSA was rising, so probably not missed much there) I'm back where I've been so many times over the years.  The cancer becoming more agressive and my PSA rising alarmingly.  PSA 4214 on 2 March, and doubling time of 5-6 weeks. I doubt I'm going to follow this number any longer - what's the point?  Although a slow down, if only temporary would be a boost.

Was given chance to see the latest bone and CT scan images.  Tumor on right rib has dissapeared, but more tumors have appeared in pelvic bones - quite literally all over.  One in particular is larger than the others and pressing against nerves, sending pain down my right leg and up into my back.  I was given a one-off radiotherapy treatment to target this, but I've had so much radiation to that area already that there was a real limit as to how much I could have.  Not enough it turned out.  I could almost here the tumor laughing - "is that all you've got".   Ur-g-h-h.   Well actually, no, that's not all I've got.  A few weeks later I was given a second (last chance), and this time there didn't appear to be any holding back.  Not quite sure why the change of heart, but I'm up for any treatment that can help me, even if it is a rocky road - I'm not ready to give up yet.  It was a long day in hospital - the doctors fitting me in where ever they could, but I had to wait my turn and after many hours my unwelcome tumor got another dose of what was coming, and this time it didn't laugh - it screamed.  The journey home was a nightmare, and as I sat in the car in one of those emergency lay-bys on the M1 hurling into a barf-bag (always keep those handy) I fealt I had hit an all time low.  I barely got out of bed for the next few days - not that I got much sleep.  I just kept telling myself that this too shall pass, and that there has to be hope.

Rough days followed, but I finally got the pain meds sorted.  Fatigue and weakness are a daily fact of life, but I can manage without the walking stick now, and if there has been nerve damage, well I can still walk and move around well enough.  Although my quality of life has taken a tumble, really, what did I expect at this time.  It's a sobering thought though.  Like many in this situation I've tried to do stuff with the time I've still got, and Christmas/New Year saw me in Latin America.  In mid January I was wandering across some volcano at 4000m in the Andes above Quito.  No problem.  A few weeks later I'm limping into CT scanner suite, and shortly afterwards I need a walking stick for support.

Now approved for Radium 223 treatment, which should start in mid-April.  Stuff I've read is generally encouraging, and I'm hopeful it can buy more time - I could see in 2024 and maybe get to 5 years after diagnosis before I finally "wear out" (was originally given "months").  And if it does work, the extra time bought might see Lutetium become available on the NHS, so another potential plus.

 

Edited by member 27 Mar 2023 at 14:08  | Reason: additional detail

User
Posted 17 May 2023 at 00:26

Not just a rocky road, but rather a deserted one, except for me by the look of things. 

For what it's worth - an update.  Had my second Radium 223 injection 10 days ago.  Difficult to assess what's really going on.  Since February I've been on Fentanyl and Abstral for pain relief - at one point, before the Radium 223 treatment started I'd bumped the Fentanyl up to 62 micrgrams/hour just to get some rest from the living hell I seemed to be in.  It worked quite well - I slept for about 20 hours a day, and didn't really care much in the few hours I was actually conscious.  After I got over one particulary high dose of EBR back in March (I think...) the pain lessened and I got the Fentanyl down over the period of a week or so to 12 micrograms/hour, with only occassional use of Abstral.

After both of my Radium 223 injections there's been a day or so when I've felt fine, then the pain starts to ramp up.  I'm on Pregabalin for the Nuerophathic pain that affects my right leg, but I seriously wonder whether It's doing anything other than making me sleepy and dopey - increasing the dosage just increases the side effects without any difference to pain levels.  After three weeks of the first Radium cycle things suddenly got a lot better, and for the fourth week things were good.  Now, in the middle of week two of the second cycle I'm struggling a bit - and clearly I haven't got the pain meds properly sorted.  I tried Gabapentin, but that just knocked me out.  I seem to have to take both Gabapentin or Pregabalin in their maximum doses, but neither seems that good with the pain, and the side effects leave me struggling to function.  Maybe I should rely on just the Fentanyl.

Anyone else had experience with all this?

The pain now is no worse than it was before, and if towards the end of cycle I get some quality time then it's probably worth it.

PSA was up to 6250 on 2 April.  An increase of around 2000 in one month, suggesting a slow down in the rate of increase from 5-6 weeks doubling time to around 8 weeks doubling time, so the EBR appears to have had some good effect, even if only temporary.

Like I say - it feels like a rocky road - a bit of a struggle.  Back in January I was trundling across some Volcano above Quito in the Andes.  The lack of oxygen was a problem, but mobility wasn't.  Now I'm trundling with the aid of a walking stick, and a three mile wander through a local woodland took well over two hours, but I did spend a lot of time admiring the wild flowers and beauty of the place.  The following day I spent "working" in the garden - didn't seem to get much done (compared with past performance), but it did feel great to be out there trying.  May have overdone it there, as the following day the pain was much worse - urghh - you just can't win.

Back to the positive side - I'm getting good support from the paliative care staff, and the Hospice physiotherapy staff came out to see me and recomended various stuff, including exercises that have made a difference - I can walk properly without my right foot slamming down on the floor all the time.  And who knew - if the problem is weakness in the right leg, then you use a walking stick in your left hand and accompany the movement of the right leg.  And it works!  My GP continues to be very supportive and even the District Nurse showed up.

However, overhanging everything is "the sword of Damocles".  The cancer has spread to my spine, and that bit in particular is what my oncologist is concerned most with.  We've talked bluntly about this, and how likely metastatic spinal compression is now, and as time progresses.  Statistics aren't very helpful - if it happens then it's 100%, if not then 0%.  Just that it's a possibility, and that as time progresses the chances increase, so I feel like I've been told my fortune (wrong word) and now have a pretty good idea of how the rocky road may end.  I can only hope it's a while away yet, because in some strange way, and despite all the agro that the cancer is giving me, at times I feel as alive and in touch with what's around me as ever.  And I don't want to give this up.  Just wandering around my garden looking what's growing and flowering, and looking out across the fields and sky on my daily walks puts a real smile on my face.  Or maybe it's all the drugs?  Either way, when ther pain is under control life is good.

Third cycle of Radium 223 in early June.  Just hope I can get the pain control sorted once and for all.

Does / has anyone else had experience of how the level of pain can vary across the cycle - getting worse at the start, but improving at some point as the weeks roll by?  I recall reading something about the bones expanding as the radium is absorbed, then contracting later as most of the radium leaves the body.

User
Posted 17 May 2023 at 09:03

Hi Dean 

I've no answers to your questions but I felt I needed to reply to your last post on how touching it was and so well put,I wish you all the best and the your QOL improves and you can squeeze every bit of time out of your current treatment.

Regards Phil 

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 08:43

Morning Dean

 

I don't usually venture into this part of the forum but am glad I did following my read of your comments. Like Phil, I can't answer your questions but just wanted to say what a well-written piece that shows how indomitable the human spirit often is. Fingers crossed that you see 2024 and beyond.

 

My thoughts are with you

 

Ivan

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 10:52
The spring flowers in the woods are lovely at the moment, the garden is all keen and growing like the clappers.

Keep in touch with your medical team and make sure they are doing their best for you. Regarding pain relief my only experience to date has been with acute pain from infection or injury and chronic pain from arthritis. The common theme in controlling it was making sure you keep on top of it and make sure you take your meds on time and not when the pain is reminding you.

Fingers crossed the Radium does its job in June..

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 19:29

DeanA,

I'm sorry, but I can't answer your questions either.  I just hope that you can find a way to keep the pain under control with the aid of the palliative care tea.  

Every good wish for the future.

JedSee.

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 20:50

Hi Jed, thank you.  Yes indeed the “journey” is less lonely when you know others are in similar spots and can share a little or at least empathise.  

Cheers

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 03:32

A beautifully written post.  Thank you for writing, 

Michael 

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 07:32
Fab road trip, great parking too!

My experience was second hand with my dad 25 years ago. He reached your stage very quickly as there was no chemo or 2nd line HT back then, just Zoladex and Radio therapy for troublesome mets. In other ways the experience was the same as yours to date and key to quality of life was a good relationship with his medics and nursing staff. Sounds like you have that sorted.

PS I think the reason your first post didn't get much response because there wasn't a lot to say, as a motivated patient actively involved with your treatment decisions you were already the best "subject matter expert".

Not my area of expertise but I do find myself wondering if Pluvicto or whatever it is called was an option? I am sure matron will pipe up and say why it isn't and that I shouldnt keep bleating on about it! The other thing you haven't mentioned is the oestrogenic treatment HT that used to be used.

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 07:38

Dean and Michael,

Thank you so much for sharing your stories, they have really touched me. Like others I can’t offer any advice but my heart goes out to both of you. Your strength in being able to talk about what you’re going through is an inspiration to all of us. Dean, I’m so pleased you have managed to live some of your dreams while still able to do so..  I suspect that the reason why your original post didn't receive many responses perhaps was that people just didn’t know what to say to you, which is rather strange because we’ve all been at the receiving end of that to some extent. All I can say is that I wish you both well for the future and that whatever treatment they are able to give you that it gives you some respite.

Take care both of you,

Derek

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 08:49

You post touched my soul, your talent for writing such a sensitive factual post in your situation reflects your resilience and bravery.

Thankyou.

Leila 

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 11:19

Full of admiration pal. Just keep going, keep enjoying, keep a sense of humour where possible. I guess many just don't know what/how to respond - we are all hopeful and you give us all even more hope. Just don't give up.

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 19:11

DeanA,

Thanks for your latest post.  Your road is a hard one.  I hope you can get some ease soon.

Take good care of yourself.

JedSee.

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 21:00

Superb writing, DeanA. I thought you might like to read a couple of the posts from those who have walked in your shoes in years gone by - Nimeniton and Andy Ripley (yes, the international sportsman) - if you want to skip the first few pages of Andy's thread, page 4 is probably a good starting point

https://community.prostatecanceruk.org/posts/t11467-The-moon-reflects-three-years-on 

https://community.prostatecanceruk.org/posts/t2678-Just-another-story/page4 

Do you live alone?

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 21:02

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member
Not my area of expertise but I do find myself wondering if Pluvicto or whatever it is called was an option? I am sure matron will pipe up and say why it isn't and that I shouldnt keep bleating on about it! The other thing you haven't mentioned is the oestrogenic treatment HT that used to be used.

 

Harsh! 

I think both a good questions to ask the onco - why have these not been considered / are they worth trying now? 

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 21:08

Had an appointment today and I was correct in my PSA prediction  (it was 2300 albeit that was from a blood test t 3 weeks ago).  I suspect now I will be at 6k.  I am just waiting on finding out about some possible shadows in my lungs.  If they are a thing then I can’t get the radium that you are getting Dean.  Apparently if you have visceral mets you can’t get radium.  

Not sure about you Dean but I feel strangely calm, maybe I am in denial.  But I feel nature has a lot to offer me just now and your posts about nature are very inspirational. 

Take care 

Michael 

Edited by member 19 May 2023 at 21:09  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 20 May 2023 at 01:00
You seem to have been given the impression that SCC is a cert - it isn't. I have seen many friends go through their last days on this forum over the last 13 years and can think of only 3 who had a SCC
"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 20 May 2023 at 02:15

Hi Dean, thank you for the comprehensive reply to me and yes I know what you mean about PSA numbers and how now it feels mildly odd to even care given the size of the number.  There is a rather odd fascination with it on my part though lol.  Maybe I think I can get some sort of record and like you I wonder about how high it can go.  Worth regard to treatments I can and can’t have, Today she seemed to be saying that radium was dangerous if given with soft tissue mets.  At the time I accepted this and of course still do but in saying that does it really matter at this point what is dangerous or not dangerous lol.  I have been told to quit impact exercise too due to my neck of femurs crumbling somewhat, but will I still run……! 

Anyway once again thanks again for your insights into this odd and horrible  disease.  Like you today I was told my PCa wasn’t behaving like a standard PCa would or should and I was unusual in that sense.  I could think of other reasons to be unusual and interesting.  It is very helpful to read your insights into the Radium treatment so thanks you so much for that and for sharing your experience other wise from diagnosis.  I am a year down the line now and can see so much of my self in your experience.  Thank you I am very grateful. 

Michael 

User
Posted 20 May 2023 at 16:43

Lyn - forgot to mention this above.  Andy Ripley constantly refers  to the benefits Dexamethasone had for him.  I've only been on it intermitently for short periods, but am wondering why it seems to have gone out of fashion?  I'm back on it now at 6mg / day in an effort to deal with pain.  For some reason today, 2 weeks 2 days after 2nd Radium injection the pain has debilitated me.  Spent most of the day laying down with my knees raised right up - the only comfortable position.  Can barely walk - moving around the house by grasping onto anything that gives support.  Managed a few sips of tea and half a bagel before the pain forced me back to bed.  Can't figure it out - shouldn't the pain be starting to subside by now?  Talked to the Doctor at the hospice.  Next step is to be admitted and let them look after me for a while whilst they try different things on the pain - stuff I can't manage myself at home.  Might not be a bad idea - I don't want to slip into the state things go into back in Februay / March where I was barely coping at home - and it showed.  Only thing I can think of - was working in the garden again yesterday - nothing stenuous, but on my feet for 7 hours continuous.  Maybe today is payback for overdoing it?  But I can't help myself - the weather was great and I love working in the garden - it's very rewarding, but perhaps there's a message from my body here and I need to really limit the time I spend on working and give the rest to sitting in a deck chair and enjoying the surroundings.

I live alone, and really don't wont to be a burden on anyone else - I would hat that anybody elses life was blighted by my cancer and that they had to look after me - what a burden.  I think "hard bitten" would be a severe way of describing me, but I'm pretty tough and thick skinned and all this makes me determined to go on as long as possible, and if anything be rather dismissive of problems as they show up.  This may not be such a good stategy - I'm inclined to dismiss side effects rather than reporting them immediately.  But I'm also very hopeful - I've never even come close to giving up, and despite the "Hard Bitten" bit I have empathy.  One of Gordon Browns last posts:

Just had the dreaded conversation with doctor who is going to refer me for palliative care. as have exhausted treatment options.Should be a few months of life left but no body knows for certain. Live in Bromley kent

My  wife is in her mid seventies it's all a bit of a shock for us.She is too elderly and frail to look after me 24/7.Grateful for any practical advice.They are  apparently writing to my GP and local hospice.

In essence prefer to use NHS resources to maximum extent and to die in hospice environment rather than be massive burden on wife who would run herself ragged trying to cope.

Any advice welcome on how to cope welcome .Prefer to leave wife some savings to supplement her small pension rather than burn through them in private nursing home!

brought a tear to my eye.  I'm not far behind him.  If I was in his situation things would be so much harder - I'd be so much more concerned about my partner than myself.  So being alone does have it's benefits!

Thanks for the info on SCC - I know it's uncommon, but it haunts me - "the sword of Damocles".  And with the pain now affecting both legs... u-r-g-h

I really want to see the Radium treatment through - it may have some (small) impact on the cancer, and if so then I'm up for it, but the pain really needs to be gotten under control.  I can tolerate it, but the effects on quality of life and ability to do stuff are so severe that on balance it may not be worth it.  That means giving up on it, and I'm not programmed that way - it will be a tough call and like when my Cabazitaxel cycle 10 got cancelled, I'll always wonder what might have happened if I'd had it.

 

User
Posted 20 May 2023 at 20:17

Hi DeanA,

I really hope that they can get the pain under control.

Sending you very best wishes.

JedSee.

User
Posted 22 May 2023 at 03:39

Great post Dean and interesting and correct view I feel from the hospice team to take pain killers till the daily limit so long as you are tolerating.  I am ok with Morphine at the moment and I also use Ravlo patches for some local pain relief.   My hospice nurse mentioned fentanyl for future use so it is good to know they have these things in reserve or in your case in action. 

I feel you now have a responsibility to see this plant flower in January.  So you need to do what you can to see it flower.  I am sure I won’t be alone in wanting to see a photo.  I know it can be annoying when people say these things, so please take it as intended which is tongue in cheek.  My sister in law is getting married a year in Nov and i did say ohhhh that is quite a long time away…! I don’t think people close to me want to hear my humorous thoughts on future dates.  

Thanks again for your post and I for one am glad you were able to get out and enjoy the lovely day, as well as catch a bargain! 

I hope you don’t feel I am hijacking your posts.  I read them  with interest and send my support and thoughts to you. 

Best wishes and sleep well 

Michael 

User
Posted 23 May 2023 at 20:58

Dean A,

Very best wishes.

JedSee.

User
Posted 25 May 2023 at 02:24

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

Hi.  Thanks for the good wishes and comments - it's always worth hearing about other peoples experiences.  I too find that people really don't want to hear much about my cancer, or how it's affecting me.  Not quite sure why - maybe it's something they fear.  The other side is they go on (and on) about those lucky people who got diagnosed early enough to get "cured" and lived for decades before it came back, in which time they'd done a charity climb of Mt Everest, set up a charitable foundation and sailed single handed around the world... (sorry about the rant).  Nobody wants to talk up front about the terminal side of it - even back in 2019 when I knew I had years to go, and it kinda cuts me off from people.

 

I couldn’t agree any more with this quoted section.  I think it is fear and really just not knowing what to say.  Thanks for your post also and I hope you get some pain relief sorted.  I am waiting on a final decision on Radium 223 here and your experience is very useful to read and know about.  You mention in cycle 1 things improved.  Have they said how many cycles?  Or is it just till you all say no more?  Thanks again DeanA for taking the time to post.  It is so frustrating not being able to physically do what you know you could even just weeks ago.  It hurts my very being, I am sure you are the same. Sending best wishes.  Michael  

User
Posted 03 Jun 2023 at 11:14

The journey continues, and has taken an unlikely turn.  I'd planned to have a short break in the Lake District over the Holiday weekend.  When I booked it a month or so back it seemed quite a reasonable expectation, but the Universe had other plans. 

Instead of the pain easing as the Radium cycle progressed it got worse, much worse, so instead of driving up to the Lakes I was talking to the Doctor responsible for my medication.  I finally realised that things were getting beyond my ability to cope at home alone and that it had reached the "enough is enough" point.  On Sunday I was admitted to the local Hospice, and I've let them take over for the last week.

My pain meds have been adjusted and added to - still not quite there yet.  Trying to find the right balance between acceptable pain and being too dopey to function properly.  Weakness in my legs is also an issue - feel at times that I can't support my own body and that I'm going to stumble and collapse.  Had a few near misses.  Disconcerting to see how weak I've become and how tiredness and fatigue are affecting me.

On the up side I feel very fortunate to be getting the care I'm receiving - for a while at least I'm in excellent hands and I don't have to worry about what's going on.

So at just the point where I was starting to stumble along the Rocky Road way I found a Refuge - like one of those "Rest and be Thankful" Inns from days gone by.

User
Posted 03 Jun 2023 at 11:51

Hi Dean 

I'm following your progress and I'm hoping this is just a blip and this is just a rest period and you get back on road for a bit longer,I totally understand that nothing can be planned to far in advance nowadays you just don't know what awaits around the corner.

Take care regards Phil 

User
Posted 03 Jun 2023 at 19:37

DeanA,

So sorry to hear that your Lake District trip has had to be postponed.  At least you're getting cared for and hopefully they'll get the right balance between pain relief and sedation.

Take good care of yourself.

JedSee.

User
Posted 04 Jun 2023 at 21:13

Thanks for the responses - it's reassuring to know that there are others out there.  I am being very well looked after in the Hospice.  I'd rather be here than in a Hospital.  The focus here is on pain relief and keeping comfortable, and you get your own room, so there's privacy and quiet when you want it - something that was definitely lacking last year when I experienced a communal ward in one of the hospitals.  Honestly, people watching TV with the sound blaring out at 2am in the morning, and others on their mobile phones 24/7. 

Slowly there seems to be progress with the pain control.  Tomorrow I'm due my 3rd Radium injection.  I only hope this doesn't set back the progress I've made over the last week.  I'm on rather high doses of meds, and it's reaching the point where going higher would make it difficult living at home.  Pregabalin at 600mg/day; Fentanyl at 62micrograms/hour; Deloxatene at double what it started at (need to pay more attention); but for at least today no need for Abstral or Oromorph, which must be a good sign.

Walking with the aid of two sticks, but can manage short runs (100m) without.  Getting a Zimmer frame to help when I'm back in my garden, which I hope will be sometime later this week.

Since I've been staying at a Hospice I guess some sort of voluntary contribution is in order, but I've no idea what the going rate is - I don't want overdo it when I've no idea how much more time I've got, neither do I want to appear cheap.  Anyone had experience with this?

User
Posted 04 Jun 2023 at 21:43
The hospice will absolutely not expect a voluntary contribution from you - in my experience, they are very happy to hear later that they have received something in a person's will or are the charity of choice for a family get-together / friends' sponsored activity / funeral collection.

Hope that tomorrow's R223 helps rather than hinders and that you are back in your garden soon.

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 06 Jun 2023 at 22:17
Thanks Lyn. The Rocky Road seems to have come to an end. An ambulance took me from the Hospice to Weston Park yesterday. I found I was too weak to cope with the few steps out of the ambulance and fell on the last step - fortunately the driver was standing by and caught me. Not a great start to the day. I saw the Oncologist and we talked about the pain I was still experiencing, and whilst it now seems to be under control it's taking a lot of meds to do it. Worse still the pain and cancer is starting to affect my left leg, so it looks like the Radium 223 isn't helping any longer, and a third does might do more harm than good. So that's the end of that. On the plus side I got another CT scan and external beam radiation to my left pelvis in an attempt to fight the cancer there.

Back at the Hospice we are talking about my return home, which is going to be more complex than I thought. The hospital bed in my lounge is going to happen, along with an additional banister on the stairs and grab bars in the bathroom.

It's a lot to cope with, physcologically, for someone who has lived independently and without physical disabilities, but it's the only way forward. The Oncologist was not optimistic about the strength returning to my legs, but there's a chance. I'm doing a load of exercises every day and I seem to have full movement. I wander around the corridors here with and without the aid of my sticks. Without the sticks I'm walking like a child who's just learnt to walk - I have to really focus, watch my feet and look at the floor ahead. But I can do it.

My thoughts now are about how different my life is going to be from here on, and how I'm going to deal with all the new challenges that present themselves. I'm sure it's going to be quite a journey, I just hope I'm up to it.

User
Posted 07 Jun 2023 at 00:12
Dean, has anyone talked to you about applying for PIP under the special rules? Or, if you are over the official retirement age (which I don't think you are), applying for Attendance Allowance?

PIP is not means tested and, under the special rules, can be applied for when the specialist is willing to say there is a reasonable chance of you living less than 12 months. If you live longer, you just get more! PIP (or AA) is to help you pay for the things that will make your life manageable - whether that is practical equipment (not provided by adult social care), home help, domiciliary care, etc. I rather hope that the hospice SW has already alerted you to this and many hospices have volunteers who will help complete the application form.

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 07 Jun 2023 at 18:43

DeanA,

So sorry to hear this.  I hope that you will be provided with all the equipment you need to maintain your independence for as long as posssible.

Take good care of yourself.

JedSee.

User
Posted 08 Jun 2023 at 08:25
Inspirational posts DeanA long may they continue.
User
Posted 08 Jun 2023 at 09:40
Dean

You sir are a bloody inspiration!!

EOL comes to us all eventually and the way that you write about it can do nothing but inspire us all on how to live what time we have on this earth.

Thank you for your insight and bravery and to all those involved in Hospice care too.

User
Posted 08 Jun 2023 at 17:25

Ditto what Steve says you are a inspiration long may it continue all the best gaz 👍

User
Posted 08 Jun 2023 at 18:12

Here here 

Regards Phil 

User
Posted 14 Jun 2023 at 10:50
You write so eloquently about your situation that it always brings a lump to my throat but you really do inspire a lot of us and you have created memories that will last a very long time.

I did have a crazy thought and I have no idea of your situation, but my wife and I have been lucky enough to travel to many places, including a long period travelling throughout the USA. However, between her medical situation and mine and limited funds, we are never likely to be able to repeat this and so I started dabbling with Virtual Reality and purchased a pair of Meta Quest 2 VR headsets. One of the free apps is called 'Wander' and it's basically Google Street View in 3D - it's literally like being there and you can look around in all directions and travel the roads, not only of places that we have been and have such happy memories of, but also places that we have wanted to visit but never did.

It means that we can sit in our chairs and visit almost anywhere in the world in 3D.

It might be something that you would enjoy given your lack of mobility and you honestly don't look the slightest bit silly wearing them - honest :) :)

Take care and our thoughts are with you.

User
Posted 14 Jun 2023 at 18:30

You are indeed a very Brave man DeanA and I can’t tell you how much your posts touch me.
To be able to talk openly about your situation shows so much courage and my thoughts are with you.

Derek

User
Posted 14 Jun 2023 at 19:23

Hi DeanA,

I'm so very sorry to hear of your situation.  I hope you can achieve full relief from pain and that you get to potter about in your garden, which might bring some measure of contentment.

Best wishes,

JedSee.

User
Posted 14 Jun 2023 at 22:09

Dean,

Been following your story for a while.

Difficult to say the right words but you are an inspiration. 

I guess we would all like to think that we leave a 'legacy'. But you really have touched the lives of so many on here. 

Kindest of regards

Jim

User
Posted 16 Jun 2023 at 08:26
Your posts have really touched me Dean, you are incredible. Difficult to say the right words, but hoping your pain can be controlled. Best wishes. X
User
Posted 16 Jun 2023 at 12:02

Dean, your posts have touched my soul, your writings are insightful and informative, and for that I thank you.

I hope your pain in managed and you are able to do some of the many things you planned to. You are one brave man who has shared words that can be hard to read, written with sensitivity and style. 

Thankyou Dean. 

User
Posted 17 Jun 2023 at 08:35

Yes, as long as you have a hotspot or wifi sharing available from your smartphone then you are golden.

There are plenty of websites, youtube channels and forums dedicated to it but when you have it set up just search and install "Wander" for starters - let us know what you think as it blew us away :)

Take care and best wishes

Edited by member 17 Jun 2023 at 08:38  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 17 Jun 2023 at 09:51

Dean your story is heartbreaking and inspiring at the same time, my husband was diagnosed in April 2021 with advanced metastatic pc and I keep trying to tell him to live for today, he’s still working he says he doesn’t want to go into his pension yet but I ask him what are you waiting for he’s 61, his mobility isn’t great, we met up with my son, daughter in law and 2 grandchildren in Florida last November we got airport assistance which was a godsend and we hired electric wheelchair for Disney parks, I’ve just talked him into going to Florida again this November but not doing Disney parks this time.

best wishes

ann

User
Posted 03 Jul 2023 at 13:57

Several weeks since my last post, and so much has changed - little of it for the better.  For a while things were looking up, sufficiently enough for me to be discharged from the Hospice after a stay of 23 days.  It seemed like a good idea at the time, but it rapidly turned into a disaster.  After 4 days I was taken on a stretcher back to the Hospice - it was fortunate that a bed was available - and I've been here since.  Blood tests on arrival showed a heamoglobin score of 53.  It should be (and in early April was) between 120-130, a score of less than 80 is of concern, and less than 70 gets you a blood transfusion.  Other blood scores were on the low side.

Hard to believe that things had deteriorated so much so fast.  I got 3 litres of blood transfused over the next few days, which managed to push my heamoglobin score up to 72.

The Doctor mentioned that the cancer was spreading through the bones in my pelvis, and affecting my bone marrow in the process.  Another problem is internal bleeding.  They could send me to hospital for tests and scans, but if the result was a need for surgery then it stops there.

I had a very open and frank talk with one of the Doctors here and she advised me that I had less than 6 months to live.  The cancer seems to be quite aggressive.  It's impossible to predict how the cancer might progress.  But my pain meds seem to be working now (and so they should be judging by the dosage!) and I will be kept comfortable.  It's just as my GP told all those years ago - my death will be much better than most: comfortable and peaceful.

It's a strange place to be.  I've slowly come to the realisation that end of life isn't far away.  I'm barely able to walk.  With sticks I can manage a hundred metres or so.  Unaided I can get around my room here, but I look like a puppet from Thunderbirds - feet flopping around and arms trying to keep balance.  You've got to laugh... sigh.

Edited by member 04 Jul 2023 at 16:02  | Reason: error

User
Posted 03 Jul 2023 at 14:03

Hi Steve86

I finally got my Meta Quest VR2.  It's like you say, totally amazing.  Thanks for the recommendation.

User
Posted 03 Jul 2023 at 14:35
Hi Dean - firstly I glad you got the Quest - when you don't have the mobility it can give you a lot of enjoyment to 'get out there' and see things you remember and places that you have never seen.

You have come to terms with your own mortality and in a way that is a blessing - many don't have that. We will all be there one day and to have the support of the hospice staff must be a blessing too as well the meds that ensure your time is relatively pain free.

Try and make the best of the time you have left and try and keep in touch as much as you are able - I know you bring a lot of support to others on the forum - you have a certain style that resonates with me, and I am sure, others too.

Thinking of you.

Steve

User
Posted 03 Jul 2023 at 19:20

Hi Dean

I totally agree in what Steve says,so many like myself are reading your thread as 1 day I shall be in the situation you find yourself,please try to keep on posting your story.

Regards Phil 

 

User
Posted 03 Jul 2023 at 20:27
Hi Dean,

I'm new to this community, Prostate Cancer and your Rocky Road thread.

I have just read through top to bottom and can only echo what others have said re the inspirational way you have written about your battles, fears and dreams.

You certainly grasped the opportunity to fulfil some of those dreams during your travels over those "best and happiest three and half years".

Thank you for sharing and I really hope you get to see that Hellebore bloom!

Mark

Show Most Thanked Posts
User
Posted 17 May 2023 at 00:26

Not just a rocky road, but rather a deserted one, except for me by the look of things. 

For what it's worth - an update.  Had my second Radium 223 injection 10 days ago.  Difficult to assess what's really going on.  Since February I've been on Fentanyl and Abstral for pain relief - at one point, before the Radium 223 treatment started I'd bumped the Fentanyl up to 62 micrgrams/hour just to get some rest from the living hell I seemed to be in.  It worked quite well - I slept for about 20 hours a day, and didn't really care much in the few hours I was actually conscious.  After I got over one particulary high dose of EBR back in March (I think...) the pain lessened and I got the Fentanyl down over the period of a week or so to 12 micrograms/hour, with only occassional use of Abstral.

After both of my Radium 223 injections there's been a day or so when I've felt fine, then the pain starts to ramp up.  I'm on Pregabalin for the Nuerophathic pain that affects my right leg, but I seriously wonder whether It's doing anything other than making me sleepy and dopey - increasing the dosage just increases the side effects without any difference to pain levels.  After three weeks of the first Radium cycle things suddenly got a lot better, and for the fourth week things were good.  Now, in the middle of week two of the second cycle I'm struggling a bit - and clearly I haven't got the pain meds properly sorted.  I tried Gabapentin, but that just knocked me out.  I seem to have to take both Gabapentin or Pregabalin in their maximum doses, but neither seems that good with the pain, and the side effects leave me struggling to function.  Maybe I should rely on just the Fentanyl.

Anyone else had experience with all this?

The pain now is no worse than it was before, and if towards the end of cycle I get some quality time then it's probably worth it.

PSA was up to 6250 on 2 April.  An increase of around 2000 in one month, suggesting a slow down in the rate of increase from 5-6 weeks doubling time to around 8 weeks doubling time, so the EBR appears to have had some good effect, even if only temporary.

Like I say - it feels like a rocky road - a bit of a struggle.  Back in January I was trundling across some Volcano above Quito in the Andes.  The lack of oxygen was a problem, but mobility wasn't.  Now I'm trundling with the aid of a walking stick, and a three mile wander through a local woodland took well over two hours, but I did spend a lot of time admiring the wild flowers and beauty of the place.  The following day I spent "working" in the garden - didn't seem to get much done (compared with past performance), but it did feel great to be out there trying.  May have overdone it there, as the following day the pain was much worse - urghh - you just can't win.

Back to the positive side - I'm getting good support from the paliative care staff, and the Hospice physiotherapy staff came out to see me and recomended various stuff, including exercises that have made a difference - I can walk properly without my right foot slamming down on the floor all the time.  And who knew - if the problem is weakness in the right leg, then you use a walking stick in your left hand and accompany the movement of the right leg.  And it works!  My GP continues to be very supportive and even the District Nurse showed up.

However, overhanging everything is "the sword of Damocles".  The cancer has spread to my spine, and that bit in particular is what my oncologist is concerned most with.  We've talked bluntly about this, and how likely metastatic spinal compression is now, and as time progresses.  Statistics aren't very helpful - if it happens then it's 100%, if not then 0%.  Just that it's a possibility, and that as time progresses the chances increase, so I feel like I've been told my fortune (wrong word) and now have a pretty good idea of how the rocky road may end.  I can only hope it's a while away yet, because in some strange way, and despite all the agro that the cancer is giving me, at times I feel as alive and in touch with what's around me as ever.  And I don't want to give this up.  Just wandering around my garden looking what's growing and flowering, and looking out across the fields and sky on my daily walks puts a real smile on my face.  Or maybe it's all the drugs?  Either way, when ther pain is under control life is good.

Third cycle of Radium 223 in early June.  Just hope I can get the pain control sorted once and for all.

Does / has anyone else had experience of how the level of pain can vary across the cycle - getting worse at the start, but improving at some point as the weeks roll by?  I recall reading something about the bones expanding as the radium is absorbed, then contracting later as most of the radium leaves the body.

User
Posted 17 May 2023 at 09:03

Hi Dean 

I've no answers to your questions but I felt I needed to reply to your last post on how touching it was and so well put,I wish you all the best and the your QOL improves and you can squeeze every bit of time out of your current treatment.

Regards Phil 

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 08:43

Morning Dean

 

I don't usually venture into this part of the forum but am glad I did following my read of your comments. Like Phil, I can't answer your questions but just wanted to say what a well-written piece that shows how indomitable the human spirit often is. Fingers crossed that you see 2024 and beyond.

 

My thoughts are with you

 

Ivan

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 10:52
The spring flowers in the woods are lovely at the moment, the garden is all keen and growing like the clappers.

Keep in touch with your medical team and make sure they are doing their best for you. Regarding pain relief my only experience to date has been with acute pain from infection or injury and chronic pain from arthritis. The common theme in controlling it was making sure you keep on top of it and make sure you take your meds on time and not when the pain is reminding you.

Fingers crossed the Radium does its job in June..

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 15:16

Hi Dean,  thank you for these posts.  I am in, i feel, a very similar position to you now.  I expect my PSA to be at least in the 2ks tomorrow when I see oncologist and am at 5 of 10 Docetaxel treatments.  Like yourself I have extensive bone mets and am on morphine and gabas at the moment as well as pa Ralvo patches for numbing some particulars areas (ribs especially as every rib had mets).  I am ok with the GABAs, but they do leave me a little space cadet like at times.  Morphine does the trick but dose is having to rise to keep up.  I find that my nurse from the hospice is the best person to talk to about pain and she bridges between oncology and GP.  Like yourself I have mets in the spine and it terrifies me.  I have been told that I may also be a candidate for radiation direct to bones so I am interested in your experience.  Also some possiblily of targeted genetic treatments but that is still to be determined. 

Look after yourself Dean and the best advice I have had from my hospice nurse is to go with the messages the body is sending, rest when needed and don’t accept pain, there is so much they can do to take it away so keep a record and keep asking for help.  

Again thanks for your posts which this afternoon been so helpful to me to see someone else who has a similar profile of PSA rise and spread and progression of the disease. Sending you best wishes. Sometimes I have felt I am the only one who is not able to keep this cancer at bay.   

Cheers

Michael 

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 19:29

DeanA,

I'm sorry, but I can't answer your questions either.  I just hope that you can find a way to keep the pain under control with the aid of the palliative care tea.  

Every good wish for the future.

JedSee.

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 19:31

Hi Mgfol68,

I'm sorry to hear how lonely your 'journey' feels at times and hope that sharing your feelings on here is of some help.

Best wishes,

JedSee.

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 20:50

Hi Jed, thank you.  Yes indeed the “journey” is less lonely when you know others are in similar spots and can share a little or at least empathise.  

Cheers

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 21:46
Dean, the problem with R223 is that it doesn't really treat the prostate cancer but targets the bone nets to improve quality of life. Unfortunately for some men, it makes the bone pain worse instead of better and therefore defeats its own purpose. We have gad a dew men on here who have stopped R223 early - only you and your onco can decide whether it is improving your QoL or not.

As men come towards the palliative / end stage, it can be a delicate process to get pain meds balanced properly - enough to be fairly comfortable without being completely knocked out all the time. Generally speaking, the hospice nurses / pain clinic / palliative care team are much better at this than GPs or onco / urologists.

I am in awe of your resilience!

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 18 May 2023 at 22:34

Thankyou everyone for your responses and good wishes.  Rocky road not quite to lonely now.  It's a strange road to be on, and nothing in my life has prepared me for it.  I'm guessing that most people using this forum have had their cancer diagnosed early enough for it to be treated successfully and then spend many years just keeping an eye on things in case the cancer reappears, so PSA scores are very low - no more than single figures, or even decimals.  So they get to ring the bell and have every reason to celebrate.  But for those of us who didn't catch it in time (even when I was diagnosed with locally advanced cancer I still didn't present any of the classic symptoms that would have raised the flag) it's a very different world.  My latest PSA score on 2 May was 10,233 which suggests it has returned to the doubling time of around 6 weeks.  So much for the slow down back in March.

I remember the oncologist talking with me on our first meeting, and explaining how the Hormone Treatment + Docataxel, followed by radiotherapy would sort the cancer out for a while, bringing my PSA right down, and keeping it there for, well maybe a year or more.  I'd be discharged from Weston Park and my GP could keep an eye on things.  Not quite how it worked out. 

My PSA did come down to 2 (from over 900), but even before the radiotherapy finished it was rising alarmingly.  So instead of being discharged I found myself in a revolving door going straight back into Weston Park and my new oncologist discussing whether I wanted to try Arbiritone or Enzalutamide.  I'd been looking forward to that year off treatment, but what can you do?  I chose Enzalutamide (because it's easier to manage - no timing issues through the day), and it worked for a while, but not as long as it might before PSA starting rocketing.  Then followed Cabazitaxel - they didn't do a very good job of selling this stuff - "life threatening chemotherapy" and it was put to me that I might prefer to just slide into palliative care?  Er, no.  I understand that some people have a nightmare of a time with it, but the reality for me was that it was much easier to manage than docataxel, and after 9 cycles of the stuff I was ready for the number 10 - no problem.  But the cancer had other ideas, and my PSA was already rising rapidly, so cycle 10 got cancelled.

All of this was punctuated with rounds of radiotherapy and periodically the tumors started wreeking havoc in my pelvis causing no end of pain and putting me out of action for a while.  But the radiotherapy always worked suprisingly well, and once I got it things improved usually within days.  Throughout this time (Aug 2019 - Jan 2023) I was able to lead a fairly normal life, and do the sort of stuff I wanted (like travel) given that I wasn't going to have a long retirement of 20 - 30 years, but a rather compressed one of maybe 2 - 3 years.  And I was only 58 (literally my Birthday) when I was diagnosed, so I hadn't even made it to retirement!

I was able to keep my fairly normal life going up until the end of January this year.  Then things started to go downhill rapidly.  From the end of COVID international travel restrictions back in November 2021 I'd spent as much time as I could travelling - often within Europe, but with long hauls to the Americas too.  It was amazing, but there was a real sense of "now or never", and at times trying to do too much.  The high point was my road-trip across the SW USA.  I picked up a rental at Las Vegas Airport and drove out across Nevada, stopped of at the Hover Dam, and then headed east across the Arizona Desert, picking up the interstate at Kingman and then heading up into the Arizona high-country.  The weather changed from warm sunshine to stormy - bright sunshine on the hills around me contrasted with jet black clouds ahead, and as I topped Coyote Pass the snow was really coming down.  Maybe I should have gone for the SUV 4WD upgrade after all?  But my very sporty and comfortable Sedan coped well enough, and got me to Williams by dusk.  As I pulled into the Motel car park I skided slightly on ice and the car miraculously slid almost perfectly into a parking spot outside what turned out to be my room.  "This is going to be the mother of all roadtrips" I thought to myself.  And so it was.  Looking back now I'm so greatful I did it, and had the chance to do it.  Ironically, if I'd never been diagnosed I'd probably never have done much of the long-haul stuff I managed - the money would have gone on paying bills and fixing the house.  But with no long-term to bother with, I could afford to spend money on living my dreams, and for a while at least have the sort of life I'd long wished for.  Eventually all dreams have to end, and maybe that's where I am now. 

It was a very unpleasant awakening, and I don't really recall much about February and March, except that I didn't get a single nights decent sleep, and relied increasingly on painkillers and loads of other meds to keep it all together.  I did at times question whether it was worth going on - my quality of life was zero, and if this was not going to improve much than it might be time to throw in the towel.  But that's not me, and no matter how rubbish it all got I believed that there was some chance that things would improve - the radiotherapy which at first wasn't on the table suddenly was, and then more of it.  A ray of hope to grasp.  April saw a slow - very slow but steady improvement and things have been, well not brilliant, but not bad either.  What can I expect? 

I had to understand that my life could never go back to what it was only a few months ago, and that everything now is different.  Travels - forget it.  The furthest I've been is Weston Park for consultations and treatment.  At the weekend I drove 4 miles to a local woodland and walked a 3 mile circuit before driving back.  That was the most adventurous thing I've done in nearly 4 months.  And I really enjoyed it.  Much of the time the pain makes any idea of driving a no no, but occassionally I get a repreve, and I'm confident about what I'm doing, but I never go far - Tesco or the Garden Centre, all within 10 minutes.  In the last week of the first Radium 223 cycle the pain seemed to almost vanish, so maybe it'll be the same this time and I'll get the chance to travel a little further.  I had a long talk with my GP about driving, and he was happy to let me take responsibility - afterall, I'm not stupid - however rubbish things might be at times now they'd be a hell of a lot worse if I had a car crash, so I'm not taking chances.

It's the accepting all this that's the real key to how I'm living and feeling at the moment.  In some ways it's easy.  There's loads of things I could do that I can't anymore, so forget them.  After the last few days my pain seemed to be easing and by today I had high hopes for going out somewhere maybe to one of the parks in Sheffield.  If I didn't feel up to driving then an Uber, or the train.  I slept well and very comfortably - none of the constant repositioning trying to find a pint where the pains not that noticeable.  Then I tried to get out of bed and all hell broke loose.  After two minutes trying to stand properly I had to lay back down.  The pain was unreal, despite having my Fentanyl patch and having taken 200mg of pregabalin an hour earlier.  A 400 microgram abstral slowed my heart rate and brought my breathing under control, but didn't make much difference to the pain.  After 30 minutes of trying to find a comfortable position to lay in I finally decided I needed to call this one in.  The fear of metastatic spinal compression haunts me, and this episode was a new one on me.  My doctor at the hospice talked at length about what was probably happening, and the only real solution it to increase the painkillers.

So I woke up with high hopes for the day, and it rapidly turned into a nightmare.  As the day went on the pain subsided, and by late afternoon I managed the walk to the pharmacy to get more pain meds.  Now, by evening I can walk OK, and sit down comfortably - that's another problem - when the pain ramps up I can't sit down as the pain shooting down my leg becomes unbearable.  Needless to say the pain meds leave me a bit drowsy.  So not the best of days.  But I staggered around my garden - so much in flower, and the promise of what's to come over the summer.  And I did a short walk across the fields and along a short ridge with views across Sheffield to the Peak District.  With the sun low in the sky and some lovely clouds it was worth seeing.  So actually, no such a bad day.

One thing I find difficult dealing with at the moment, and I guess there's no answer to this one.  I know that I'm approaching end-of life, but no one can say exactly when that might be.  Optimistically I might make it into 2024 and still be physically active, or it could be a matter of a few months - who knows.  Maybe the reason that my original post attracted so little attention is that those people who might have had something to add simply aren't around anymore.  As I wandered through my garden admiring the bluebells, azaleas and one rhododendron which has excelled itself this year, I can't help but think I'll never see this stuff happening again.  It's an uncomfotable thought, and it brings home the situation I'm in.  I don't know what the answer to this one is.  I guess to hope for the best, but be prepared for the worst.

 

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 03:32

A beautifully written post.  Thank you for writing, 

Michael 

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 07:32
Fab road trip, great parking too!

My experience was second hand with my dad 25 years ago. He reached your stage very quickly as there was no chemo or 2nd line HT back then, just Zoladex and Radio therapy for troublesome mets. In other ways the experience was the same as yours to date and key to quality of life was a good relationship with his medics and nursing staff. Sounds like you have that sorted.

PS I think the reason your first post didn't get much response because there wasn't a lot to say, as a motivated patient actively involved with your treatment decisions you were already the best "subject matter expert".

Not my area of expertise but I do find myself wondering if Pluvicto or whatever it is called was an option? I am sure matron will pipe up and say why it isn't and that I shouldnt keep bleating on about it! The other thing you haven't mentioned is the oestrogenic treatment HT that used to be used.

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 07:38

Dean and Michael,

Thank you so much for sharing your stories, they have really touched me. Like others I can’t offer any advice but my heart goes out to both of you. Your strength in being able to talk about what you’re going through is an inspiration to all of us. Dean, I’m so pleased you have managed to live some of your dreams while still able to do so..  I suspect that the reason why your original post didn't receive many responses perhaps was that people just didn’t know what to say to you, which is rather strange because we’ve all been at the receiving end of that to some extent. All I can say is that I wish you both well for the future and that whatever treatment they are able to give you that it gives you some respite.

Take care both of you,

Derek

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 08:49

You post touched my soul, your talent for writing such a sensitive factual post in your situation reflects your resilience and bravery.

Thankyou.

Leila 

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 11:19

Full of admiration pal. Just keep going, keep enjoying, keep a sense of humour where possible. I guess many just don't know what/how to respond - we are all hopeful and you give us all even more hope. Just don't give up.

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 19:11

DeanA,

Thanks for your latest post.  Your road is a hard one.  I hope you can get some ease soon.

Take good care of yourself.

JedSee.

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 21:00

Superb writing, DeanA. I thought you might like to read a couple of the posts from those who have walked in your shoes in years gone by - Nimeniton and Andy Ripley (yes, the international sportsman) - if you want to skip the first few pages of Andy's thread, page 4 is probably a good starting point

https://community.prostatecanceruk.org/posts/t11467-The-moon-reflects-three-years-on 

https://community.prostatecanceruk.org/posts/t2678-Just-another-story/page4 

Do you live alone?

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 21:02

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member
Not my area of expertise but I do find myself wondering if Pluvicto or whatever it is called was an option? I am sure matron will pipe up and say why it isn't and that I shouldnt keep bleating on about it! The other thing you haven't mentioned is the oestrogenic treatment HT that used to be used.

 

Harsh! 

I think both a good questions to ask the onco - why have these not been considered / are they worth trying now? 

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 19 May 2023 at 21:08

Had an appointment today and I was correct in my PSA prediction  (it was 2300 albeit that was from a blood test t 3 weeks ago).  I suspect now I will be at 6k.  I am just waiting on finding out about some possible shadows in my lungs.  If they are a thing then I can’t get the radium that you are getting Dean.  Apparently if you have visceral mets you can’t get radium.  

Not sure about you Dean but I feel strangely calm, maybe I am in denial.  But I feel nature has a lot to offer me just now and your posts about nature are very inspirational. 

Take care 

Michael 

Edited by member 19 May 2023 at 21:09  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 20 May 2023 at 00:25

Thanks everyone for your comments - it's a real boost to read this stuff.

Two weeks after the 2nd Radium 223 injection and I haven't quite got the pain meds sorted - it's a balancing act with those old style scales that bounce up and down for a while everytime something changes.  So it's 600mg of Pregabalin daily, + 37.5 microgram Fentanyl patch, 4mg of desamethosone, and 8 paracetamols.  I feel a bit spaced out (I'm chuckling as I write this) - can't thing why, but the pain seems manageable.  There are moments when it flares up pretty bad, but usually dies back down just as quickly.  I'm trying not to use the abstral too much as I need a really high dose to be effective and I don't want to overdo it.  Mobility is a bit issue, but like the pain it's difficult to find any pattern over the 4 week cycle.  Some days I can walk quite freely, and barely need the stick.  Other days I can't manage without the stick and I'm staggering about rather than walking.  The pain too is perplexing.  You'd think that it would be bad in the early stages of the cycle, and then slowly improve, but I've had days in the first week that have been almost pain free, followed by days when it definatley isn't pain free.  I'm hoping that by the end of the third week I'll get some real respite, like in cycle 1 and be able to "live" a little more.

I'd hoped to spend part of today going to the shops and a couple of nearby garden centres, then spending the rest of the day pottering around in the garden.  But the pain in my right leg meant no chance of driving - even just a few miles.  It's hard to figure - I can't sit down for even a minute during the mornings without a huge surge of pain, which I can only deal with by standing and wondering around.  Exercise like walking seems to help.  Later in the day something changes, and sitting down, and even driving becomes possible.  But it's so unpredictable. 

I guess I have to get used to this, and instead of making plans for what I'd like to do days in advance I need to wait and see what happens on the day.  This is so very different to the way I've been used to living.  But things have changed, and I need to change too - there's really no alternative, and moaning or complaining ain't going to help, so better get on with it.

Lyn - thanks for the links.  They were interesting reading.  Andy Ripley got almost 5 years of quality life after diagnosis and showed so well how to live well until the cancer finally took over.  He seemed to do well at getting on clinical trails.  Not the case for me - oncologist did mention some stuff, but I could tell from the way he was talking that is was just pie in the sky, so I never put any stock in the idea and now I've just forgotten about it.  If anything comes up I'll try it, but I'm not sitting by the phone waiting.  I fully understood what Nimeniton was talking about - these thoughts have been with me too, more so recently.  I know there is going to come a point (probably when metastatic spinal compression cripples me) when hope runs out and quality of life fall too low.  I've already decided that at such a point it's time to throw in the towel, check-out or however else you may put it.  The doctor from the Hospice has come out to see me a few times - on the last visit she commented that my lounge was plenty big enough for a hosptial bed!  Whilst the idea of a new bed with a comfortable mattress and all that adjustability at the push of buttons on a handset does hold some appeal, the reality would be that I'd be a prisoner in my own home, unable to move about, and completely reliant on other people to do everything for me.  That's not living, and in no version of my future could I put up with it.  So we can forget about the hospital bed in my lounge - I'll have to take matters into my own hands by that time...

Michael - don't get worked up about the PSA numbers.  I've just hit 10,000 and I just rolled my eyes when the doctor read it out.  It's like whatever is left of my cancer riddled prostate is spinning out of control and all it can do is produce evermore PSA - pretty useless organ I'd be well rid of.  I'm just curious as to how high it finally goes.  The specialist nurse at Weston Park told me PSA is a bit like smoke.  You can have a fire roaring away (like an aggressive cancer) and producing very little smoke, or conversley you can have a fire that's smouldering away producing loads of smoke but very little heat.  It's best not to try and read too much into these numbers - all my oncologists have told me this, and whilst I'm always curious to know what the latest score is I don't dwell on it.  In the early days I used to plot the figure on a piece of graph paper stuck on the side of my fridge.  I worked out if I tried to plot the numbers now I'd be in the attic.

Getting the Radiotherapy and Radium 223 was a real minefield for me.  At first, back in February I was told that neither would be on offer, because of - well reasons I can't now recall, and probably didn't understand at the time. But shortly afterwards, and after various scans and blood tests, and being transferred to a new oncologist I was given a low (way too low) dose of EBR - I was told I'd reached the limit for treating the particular area which was affected.  But, shortly after that there was a change in opinion, and I got a huge dose of EBR, and that really had an effect.  I never questioned any of this - just leaving it to the experts to decide what was best.  A few weeks later I saw the oncologist again, and we had a long conversation about where I was at, how difficult it was to predict what was going to happen next, the risk of further nerve damage and the chances of Radium 223 actually making any difference.  Chances were about 50/50 of it working for me.  If it did it could extend my life into next year.  if not it would just be an unpleasant experience I could have done without.  How did I feel about going into palliative care?  Hmm, been here before.  Palliative care to me means end-of-life, and I'm not ready to accept that - I simply feel in myself that this is not my time, and I still have a life that I'm continuing to live, and I'm happy with it, despite everything that's happened recently and the massive changes I've had to accept.  So, 50/50 - I've had far worse odds than that in the train wreck this is my life - bring on the Radium.  It's not been as easy as I hoped - by far the most difficult treatment I've had to cope with, but every problem has some sort of solution, and so it comes down to management, and not giving up. 

I'm not sure why I was initially told that I couldn't have Radium 223, or why the change of mind.  Unlike many others on this forum I'm not much good at actually understanding the detail I'm given - back at diagnosis, when I had the DRE / Biopsy I was told loads of stuff about how unusual my case was, and how the doctor who did the biopsy collected loads of extra samples (urgh - that biopsy went on forever - it fealt like a torture scene from Game of Thrones) and sent them off to different labs for analysis.  When I met the oncologist for the first time she had a huge folder on the desk, looked up at me and commented on the complexity and how it was "not textbook".  I never understood any of it.  Perhaps my way of dealing with the situation - I'll let the doctors deal with all that - they're the experts, and I am definately not.  It was also at this point that I decided two things.  Firstly, I'd fight the cancer with everything I was offered, and I wouldn't give up untill I was finally beaten into a quality of life that fell too low.  Secondly, I'd put my trust and faith in the doctors and medical staff - they have the knowledge and expertise, not me.  So their advice is what I follow.

I know what you mean when you talk about feeling strangely calm.  I get that a lot.  When people find out I have cancer they seem to get upset about it and start being sorry and getting a bit emotional.  I did when I was first told I had cancer.  A doctor I have (thankfully) never seen since told me quite bluntly on the 30 July 2019 (my 58th Birthday) I had advanced cancer, I wouldn't see out the year and should put my house in order, and get this - that this was Gods plan for me.  I kinda switched off a bit at this point, but I recall him going on a bit more about God.  The nurse sitting slightly behind him looked uncomfortable and embarased.  I left the room in a state of shock and spent the next 20 minutes staring out of the window on the stair well.  I drove home on auto-pilot and for the firt time in years even had a few tears - how could this be happening to me.  It kinda ruined my birthday among other things, but 24 hours later I'd found the strength from somewhere to start to deal with it.  I saw my GP later that day.  He looked at the reports and information and was baffled.  Even in the worst case senario it would take far more than a few months for the cancer to kill me, and when I mentioned the monologue about it being Gods work we both started laughing - I mean seriously the wrong wavelength!  Like I say, I've never seen that Doctor since.  The talk with my GP put me strangely at ease - we talked and were both quite upbeat about it, and it's been like that ever since.  The alternative is to fall into anger, self pity, and the "why me" mentality.  All of which are completely unhelpful.  So don't go there.  It is what it is and accepting this is the only way to go. 

I do recall how my life changed dramatically over just those few days.  I looked at what I was spending my time on, and how much was spent of stuff that really didn't matter.  So I stopped doing what seemed like loads of things that had been important, and now I realised weren't.  It was high-summer, and I went for long walks in the surrounding countryside - everything seemed a bit more real and in-touch, kinda hard to put into words.  I was signed off work, so I'd just get in the car and take off for a few days, or a week and go where ever I fealt I wanted to go - road trips (the answer to all problems).  It was a sureal time, and in a way it's continued ever since.  My life was turned upside down, so I went with the new flow, despite all the agro of having terminal cancer - I just started to move on in a new direction.

Now I've said this to people over the last nearly 4 years since diagnosis, and I don't think anybody has really understood, judging by the look on their faces.  These years have been amongst the best of my life.  I've looked at my life and how I was living and chucked out all stuff that really doesn't matter.  I'm more intouch with the nature around me and appreciate every day like I never did before.  I have been so fortunate to have a good medical team looking after me (my travels have taken me to many countries where someone like me would get no medical treatment at all - imagine how awful that must be).  I have been able to travel to places I only ever dreamt about and experienced things that have really made an impact on me, making my outlook on the world different and changing me as a person.  For all this I'm truley grateful.  It's ironic that all this has happened because I have cancer, and that my time on this Earth will be cut short... very short.  It's a bittersweet experince - on the one hand I've been able to live, for a few years at least, the kind of life I've wanted and indeed needed - on the other hand it's not going to last for long.  But even now, when things are starting to fall to pieces, I still feel generally happy and a little unconcerned about my situation.  Despite all the limitations I now have to cope with, when I wander out of the house on my frequent local walks I'm always smiling, and that's the way I want it until my time comes.

User
Posted 20 May 2023 at 01:00
You seem to have been given the impression that SCC is a cert - it isn't. I have seen many friends go through their last days on this forum over the last 13 years and can think of only 3 who had a SCC
"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 20 May 2023 at 02:15

Hi Dean, thank you for the comprehensive reply to me and yes I know what you mean about PSA numbers and how now it feels mildly odd to even care given the size of the number.  There is a rather odd fascination with it on my part though lol.  Maybe I think I can get some sort of record and like you I wonder about how high it can go.  Worth regard to treatments I can and can’t have, Today she seemed to be saying that radium was dangerous if given with soft tissue mets.  At the time I accepted this and of course still do but in saying that does it really matter at this point what is dangerous or not dangerous lol.  I have been told to quit impact exercise too due to my neck of femurs crumbling somewhat, but will I still run……! 

Anyway once again thanks again for your insights into this odd and horrible  disease.  Like you today I was told my PCa wasn’t behaving like a standard PCa would or should and I was unusual in that sense.  I could think of other reasons to be unusual and interesting.  It is very helpful to read your insights into the Radium treatment so thanks you so much for that and for sharing your experience other wise from diagnosis.  I am a year down the line now and can see so much of my self in your experience.  Thank you I am very grateful. 

Michael 

User
Posted 20 May 2023 at 16:43

Lyn - forgot to mention this above.  Andy Ripley constantly refers  to the benefits Dexamethasone had for him.  I've only been on it intermitently for short periods, but am wondering why it seems to have gone out of fashion?  I'm back on it now at 6mg / day in an effort to deal with pain.  For some reason today, 2 weeks 2 days after 2nd Radium injection the pain has debilitated me.  Spent most of the day laying down with my knees raised right up - the only comfortable position.  Can barely walk - moving around the house by grasping onto anything that gives support.  Managed a few sips of tea and half a bagel before the pain forced me back to bed.  Can't figure it out - shouldn't the pain be starting to subside by now?  Talked to the Doctor at the hospice.  Next step is to be admitted and let them look after me for a while whilst they try different things on the pain - stuff I can't manage myself at home.  Might not be a bad idea - I don't want to slip into the state things go into back in Februay / March where I was barely coping at home - and it showed.  Only thing I can think of - was working in the garden again yesterday - nothing stenuous, but on my feet for 7 hours continuous.  Maybe today is payback for overdoing it?  But I can't help myself - the weather was great and I love working in the garden - it's very rewarding, but perhaps there's a message from my body here and I need to really limit the time I spend on working and give the rest to sitting in a deck chair and enjoying the surroundings.

I live alone, and really don't wont to be a burden on anyone else - I would hat that anybody elses life was blighted by my cancer and that they had to look after me - what a burden.  I think "hard bitten" would be a severe way of describing me, but I'm pretty tough and thick skinned and all this makes me determined to go on as long as possible, and if anything be rather dismissive of problems as they show up.  This may not be such a good stategy - I'm inclined to dismiss side effects rather than reporting them immediately.  But I'm also very hopeful - I've never even come close to giving up, and despite the "Hard Bitten" bit I have empathy.  One of Gordon Browns last posts:

Just had the dreaded conversation with doctor who is going to refer me for palliative care. as have exhausted treatment options.Should be a few months of life left but no body knows for certain. Live in Bromley kent

My  wife is in her mid seventies it's all a bit of a shock for us.She is too elderly and frail to look after me 24/7.Grateful for any practical advice.They are  apparently writing to my GP and local hospice.

In essence prefer to use NHS resources to maximum extent and to die in hospice environment rather than be massive burden on wife who would run herself ragged trying to cope.

Any advice welcome on how to cope welcome .Prefer to leave wife some savings to supplement her small pension rather than burn through them in private nursing home!

brought a tear to my eye.  I'm not far behind him.  If I was in his situation things would be so much harder - I'd be so much more concerned about my partner than myself.  So being alone does have it's benefits!

Thanks for the info on SCC - I know it's uncommon, but it haunts me - "the sword of Damocles".  And with the pain now affecting both legs... u-r-g-h

I really want to see the Radium treatment through - it may have some (small) impact on the cancer, and if so then I'm up for it, but the pain really needs to be gotten under control.  I can tolerate it, but the effects on quality of life and ability to do stuff are so severe that on balance it may not be worth it.  That means giving up on it, and I'm not programmed that way - it will be a tough call and like when my Cabazitaxel cycle 10 got cancelled, I'll always wonder what might have happened if I'd had it.

 

User
Posted 20 May 2023 at 20:17

Hi DeanA,

I really hope that they can get the pain under control.

Sending you very best wishes.

JedSee.

User
Posted 22 May 2023 at 00:08

Tried a different approach this weekend.  If I am to see the course with this treatment then the pain control is what I have to focus on.  I've been kinda reluctant to take high dosages of painkillers - I had problems with morphine and its derivatives last year, and it was these problems that put me in hospital rather than the cancer!  But there's no choice now - I'm on different painkillers (fentanyl and abstral), and whilst they are still opiates (and very strong ones at that - 100 times the strenght of morphine) I seem to tolerate them better than morphine.  Spoke with one of the doctors at the hospice today and she put it so clearly and simply.  If you're in pain take the painkillers, and if it's not working then take more up to the daily limit - which is suprisingly high.  The main side effect is drowsiness, especially when I'm combining them with Pregabalin at its highest does, but again, I seem to be becoming tolerant of that - I've been up and about all weekend and was back in the car today for the short journey to a garden centre and then a little further to Morrisons, where the special offer on chocolate weetabix was too much to resist...  Oh dear, is this what my life has become?

Well maybe, but I've enjoyed the weekend - the weather has been wonderful and I've spent most of the time outside on short walks, a little driving and shopping, and a lot of time in the garden where stuff comes into flower every day.  I'm still adding plants for additional colour - it seems more important now than ever before - if this is my last summer I want it to be special. 

I'm a bit of a sucker for items that have been reduced to clear.  The garden centre had the usual collection of half dead "compost", but in and amongst this detritus I found a very healthy looking helebore at half price.  These plants are wonderful - they flower beautifully in the middle of winter right through into spring.  The label showed coral pink flowers.  It won't flower until January, and I might not be around in January.  Hmm. 

I bought it, took it home, potted it on into a larger pot, gave it a good alkali based feed and put it in a shady spot to get on with what plants do.  In early winter I'll move it to the shelf under my kitchen window, and as winter progresses it, and a few friends that also look good in winter will brighten every day when I look out at them.  I want to believe I will be around to see all this, and if I stop bothering doing stuff just because I'm on "death row" then it may become a self fulfilling profesy, and I won't be around to see anything.  It hit me as I was going through all this that one way or another I'm going to bulldoze my way forward for as long as I can, despite the recent setbacks.  It brings a smile to my face, even when I'm staggering around clumsily in the kitchen, exhaused at the end of the day, trying to make a cup of cocoa and not burn the toast.  It could be I'm just a bit high on the painkillers - but that's no bad thing, I think I've earned it.

User
Posted 22 May 2023 at 03:39

Great post Dean and interesting and correct view I feel from the hospice team to take pain killers till the daily limit so long as you are tolerating.  I am ok with Morphine at the moment and I also use Ravlo patches for some local pain relief.   My hospice nurse mentioned fentanyl for future use so it is good to know they have these things in reserve or in your case in action. 

I feel you now have a responsibility to see this plant flower in January.  So you need to do what you can to see it flower.  I am sure I won’t be alone in wanting to see a photo.  I know it can be annoying when people say these things, so please take it as intended which is tongue in cheek.  My sister in law is getting married a year in Nov and i did say ohhhh that is quite a long time away…! I don’t think people close to me want to hear my humorous thoughts on future dates.  

Thanks again for your post and I for one am glad you were able to get out and enjoy the lovely day, as well as catch a bargain! 

I hope you don’t feel I am hijacking your posts.  I read them  with interest and send my support and thoughts to you. 

Best wishes and sleep well 

Michael 

User
Posted 23 May 2023 at 20:58

Dean A,

Very best wishes.

JedSee.

User
Posted 24 May 2023 at 21:59

Hi.  Thanks for the good wishes and comments - it's always worth hearing about other peoples experiences.  I too find that people really don't want to hear much about my cancer, or how it's affecting me.  Not quite sure why - maybe it's something they fear.  The other side is they go on (and on) about those lucky people who got diagnosed early enough to get "cured" and lived for decades before it came back, in which time they'd done a charity climb of Mt Everest, set up a charitable foundation and sailed single handed around the world... (sorry about the rant).  Nobody wants to talk up front about the terminal side of it - even back in 2019 when I knew I had years to go, and it kinda cuts me off from people.

I've written recently about how much time I've been spending outside - local walks, gardening, but this week for reasons beyond me and my Doctor things have really gone downhill - I've started to stumble on the rock road, and whilst I haven't yet collapsed I'm having to stop and take some serious rests.  I can't figure it out - today is three weeks from my last Radium 223 injection and at this point in cycle 1 things were getting very noticably better.   Throughout cycle 1 I could go for walks in the morning and at any time of day.  Now for some reason shear exhaustion forces me back to lie down on my bed with knees raised and an Abstral 400 under my tongue (equivalent to 40mg of morphine) going into my system over the course of maybe 10 minutes.  It is totally debilitating, and this goes on from whenever I try to get up in the morning (7-8am) to early afternoon (if I'm lucky), but I'm still left struggling a bit for the rest of the day.  After lunch today I tried to go on my local "across the fields" walk - a round trip of about 1km.  Something I was doing everyday until this week.  Today I got 50m up the road when shear pain forced me to stagger back home and hit the Abstral, again.  It fealt soul destroying.  I'm not sure if this is the Radium, or something else.

I was hoping to go to the Barbers this afternoon - it's been a while and I'm starting to look like some homeless person.  But I can't drive there, or walk there, and even if I made it I couldn't sit in the chair long enough without the pain flaring up.  So I'm pretty much stuffed!

If there is some benefit to having the Radium treatment, then I'd like to see it through.  I was in pain before the treatment started, so it can't all be blamed on it.  My Hospice Doctor came out to see me yesterday and discussed how we might deal with all this troublesome pain.  The next step is to be admitted into the hospice and sedated whilst they try different types of pain relief - this stuff can only be done as an "in patient".  Ketamin was mentioned, so my journey up (or down) the controlled drugs ladder looks to continue.  There must be some way of getting this bl**dy pain under control.  Honestly, I could swear...

So Rock Radiation Road has suddenly become very steep and difficult - the view has vanished, and I'm wondering how much worse it could be at this moment in time.  Well actually it could be a hell of a lot worse, so I just have to be somehow grateful for what I've got.  I've always believed that whatever hand your dealt you have to play it to your best, but boy is this one putting me to the test.

User
Posted 25 May 2023 at 02:24

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

Hi.  Thanks for the good wishes and comments - it's always worth hearing about other peoples experiences.  I too find that people really don't want to hear much about my cancer, or how it's affecting me.  Not quite sure why - maybe it's something they fear.  The other side is they go on (and on) about those lucky people who got diagnosed early enough to get "cured" and lived for decades before it came back, in which time they'd done a charity climb of Mt Everest, set up a charitable foundation and sailed single handed around the world... (sorry about the rant).  Nobody wants to talk up front about the terminal side of it - even back in 2019 when I knew I had years to go, and it kinda cuts me off from people.

 

I couldn’t agree any more with this quoted section.  I think it is fear and really just not knowing what to say.  Thanks for your post also and I hope you get some pain relief sorted.  I am waiting on a final decision on Radium 223 here and your experience is very useful to read and know about.  You mention in cycle 1 things improved.  Have they said how many cycles?  Or is it just till you all say no more?  Thanks again DeanA for taking the time to post.  It is so frustrating not being able to physically do what you know you could even just weeks ago.  It hurts my very being, I am sure you are the same. Sending best wishes.  Michael  

User
Posted 03 Jun 2023 at 11:14

The journey continues, and has taken an unlikely turn.  I'd planned to have a short break in the Lake District over the Holiday weekend.  When I booked it a month or so back it seemed quite a reasonable expectation, but the Universe had other plans. 

Instead of the pain easing as the Radium cycle progressed it got worse, much worse, so instead of driving up to the Lakes I was talking to the Doctor responsible for my medication.  I finally realised that things were getting beyond my ability to cope at home alone and that it had reached the "enough is enough" point.  On Sunday I was admitted to the local Hospice, and I've let them take over for the last week.

My pain meds have been adjusted and added to - still not quite there yet.  Trying to find the right balance between acceptable pain and being too dopey to function properly.  Weakness in my legs is also an issue - feel at times that I can't support my own body and that I'm going to stumble and collapse.  Had a few near misses.  Disconcerting to see how weak I've become and how tiredness and fatigue are affecting me.

On the up side I feel very fortunate to be getting the care I'm receiving - for a while at least I'm in excellent hands and I don't have to worry about what's going on.

So at just the point where I was starting to stumble along the Rocky Road way I found a Refuge - like one of those "Rest and be Thankful" Inns from days gone by.

User
Posted 03 Jun 2023 at 11:51

Hi Dean 

I'm following your progress and I'm hoping this is just a blip and this is just a rest period and you get back on road for a bit longer,I totally understand that nothing can be planned to far in advance nowadays you just don't know what awaits around the corner.

Take care regards Phil 

User
Posted 03 Jun 2023 at 19:37

DeanA,

So sorry to hear that your Lake District trip has had to be postponed.  At least you're getting cared for and hopefully they'll get the right balance between pain relief and sedation.

Take good care of yourself.

JedSee.

User
Posted 04 Jun 2023 at 21:13

Thanks for the responses - it's reassuring to know that there are others out there.  I am being very well looked after in the Hospice.  I'd rather be here than in a Hospital.  The focus here is on pain relief and keeping comfortable, and you get your own room, so there's privacy and quiet when you want it - something that was definitely lacking last year when I experienced a communal ward in one of the hospitals.  Honestly, people watching TV with the sound blaring out at 2am in the morning, and others on their mobile phones 24/7. 

Slowly there seems to be progress with the pain control.  Tomorrow I'm due my 3rd Radium injection.  I only hope this doesn't set back the progress I've made over the last week.  I'm on rather high doses of meds, and it's reaching the point where going higher would make it difficult living at home.  Pregabalin at 600mg/day; Fentanyl at 62micrograms/hour; Deloxatene at double what it started at (need to pay more attention); but for at least today no need for Abstral or Oromorph, which must be a good sign.

Walking with the aid of two sticks, but can manage short runs (100m) without.  Getting a Zimmer frame to help when I'm back in my garden, which I hope will be sometime later this week.

Since I've been staying at a Hospice I guess some sort of voluntary contribution is in order, but I've no idea what the going rate is - I don't want overdo it when I've no idea how much more time I've got, neither do I want to appear cheap.  Anyone had experience with this?

User
Posted 04 Jun 2023 at 21:43
The hospice will absolutely not expect a voluntary contribution from you - in my experience, they are very happy to hear later that they have received something in a person's will or are the charity of choice for a family get-together / friends' sponsored activity / funeral collection.

Hope that tomorrow's R223 helps rather than hinders and that you are back in your garden soon.

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 06 Jun 2023 at 22:17
Thanks Lyn. The Rocky Road seems to have come to an end. An ambulance took me from the Hospice to Weston Park yesterday. I found I was too weak to cope with the few steps out of the ambulance and fell on the last step - fortunately the driver was standing by and caught me. Not a great start to the day. I saw the Oncologist and we talked about the pain I was still experiencing, and whilst it now seems to be under control it's taking a lot of meds to do it. Worse still the pain and cancer is starting to affect my left leg, so it looks like the Radium 223 isn't helping any longer, and a third does might do more harm than good. So that's the end of that. On the plus side I got another CT scan and external beam radiation to my left pelvis in an attempt to fight the cancer there.

Back at the Hospice we are talking about my return home, which is going to be more complex than I thought. The hospital bed in my lounge is going to happen, along with an additional banister on the stairs and grab bars in the bathroom.

It's a lot to cope with, physcologically, for someone who has lived independently and without physical disabilities, but it's the only way forward. The Oncologist was not optimistic about the strength returning to my legs, but there's a chance. I'm doing a load of exercises every day and I seem to have full movement. I wander around the corridors here with and without the aid of my sticks. Without the sticks I'm walking like a child who's just learnt to walk - I have to really focus, watch my feet and look at the floor ahead. But I can do it.

My thoughts now are about how different my life is going to be from here on, and how I'm going to deal with all the new challenges that present themselves. I'm sure it's going to be quite a journey, I just hope I'm up to it.

User
Posted 07 Jun 2023 at 00:12
Dean, has anyone talked to you about applying for PIP under the special rules? Or, if you are over the official retirement age (which I don't think you are), applying for Attendance Allowance?

PIP is not means tested and, under the special rules, can be applied for when the specialist is willing to say there is a reasonable chance of you living less than 12 months. If you live longer, you just get more! PIP (or AA) is to help you pay for the things that will make your life manageable - whether that is practical equipment (not provided by adult social care), home help, domiciliary care, etc. I rather hope that the hospice SW has already alerted you to this and many hospices have volunteers who will help complete the application form.

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 07 Jun 2023 at 18:43

DeanA,

So sorry to hear this.  I hope that you will be provided with all the equipment you need to maintain your independence for as long as posssible.

Take good care of yourself.

JedSee.

User
Posted 07 Jun 2023 at 21:37

Hi Lyn. My GP very obligingly provided me with a DS1500 last October - looks now like he may be bang on. The benefits system was bewildering to me until I was contacted by Advocacy at Rotherham MBC. A very helpful lady took me through all the benefits I was entitled too, and better still actually did most of the applications for me. This included PIP. I was told to apply for Universal Credit which would give me access to another benefit, all of which I would get automatically. The lady who dealt with my case at the Job Centre couldn't have been more helpful - everything was dealt with in one visit, and as I left she assured me I'd never need to set foot in the place again.

The physio saw me today and we worked on going up and down stairs - much easier when I do it the right way. I'm walking more and now managing without the stick, at least when I'm indoors. My big fear when I go back home is falling when I'm outside, and having real difficulty getting up, especially if I'm on the pavement. The physio is going to take me through ways of coping with this. There's also talk of having someone to assist me when I'm out.

It's kind of Ironic - as I approach end-of-life, for the first time ever I have no monetary problems, and instead of getting old and neglected I will be well cared for until the end, probably at the age of 62 assuming I make it to the end of July, which I have every intention of doing! It will be four years since I was diagnosed by that mad Doctor who told me I had months to live, should put my house in order and that it was all part of God's plan for me... Huh, this one had to go.

The next Doctor I saw was a lot more down to earth and said with all the treatments available 4-5 years was a realistic outlook, and given how aggressive the cancer has behaved it turns out to have been a pretty accurate forecast.

Nothing in life can prepare a person for this, but I've got access to counselling from a qualified physcotherapist who is doing a great job of helping me work my way through this swamp.

So all round I couldn't have been more fortunate in getting the right support at just the right time. I think I have been very lucky.

I couldn't ask for more, well other than a cure, but let's be realistic...

Edited by member 07 Jun 2023 at 21:40  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 08 Jun 2023 at 08:25
Inspirational posts DeanA long may they continue.
User
Posted 08 Jun 2023 at 09:40
Dean

You sir are a bloody inspiration!!

EOL comes to us all eventually and the way that you write about it can do nothing but inspire us all on how to live what time we have on this earth.

Thank you for your insight and bravery and to all those involved in Hospice care too.

User
Posted 08 Jun 2023 at 17:25

Ditto what Steve says you are a inspiration long may it continue all the best gaz 👍

User
Posted 08 Jun 2023 at 18:12

Here here 

Regards Phil 

User
Posted 13 Jun 2023 at 23:49

Thanks for the comments. I hope that my experiences are useful to others.

Things have moved on rapidly since my last post. By late last week I was able to walk without the need for sticks and was looking forward to being discharged on Monday. But over the weekend my situation deteriorated quite dramatically - the pain and weakness in my thighs and hips rose and even walking with the sticks became difficult. It was hard to take in.  So I'm still in the Hospice, and not sure when I might be leaving.

The physio has got me a three wheeled walker, which makes a big difference to my mobility. She and the Occupational Health worker have made up a list of stuff I will need when I return home, and a care package has been proposed. For someone who has lived very independently it's going to take some adjusting to, but I'm coming to the realisation that my world has changed big time, so I have to change with it.

By the 2nd of May my PSA was up to 14 thousand and something, so no joy there. The Radium 223 was my last real hope in terms of treatment, but that was abandoned after only two cycles. So now I can only watch and experience what happens as the cancer progresses. Based on what's happened recently the outlook isn't good.

So the Rocky Radiation Road came to a sudden end, and now I'm in a very strange place.  I'm sat on a bed in a Hospice, with little idea of when I'll be leaving.  When I do get home my life will have been turned upside down. I think it's fair to assume that End of Life isn't far off, and that I'll probably not see out the summer. The time I still have will be affected by all my physical limitations. I won't be able to drive anywhere, and even if I could I'd be limited by what I could do when I got where I was going. Even with the walker I can only manage 5-10 minutes before pain and weakness leave me needing to lay down and rest.

So my travelling days are well and truly over and I think I'll be at home all the time. If I can find a way to keep up with the garden, and cope with the stairs then I think I'll be happy enough. I knew this time would come, but not so soon.

But here it is, so I'd better embrace the situation and get on with it - the clock is ticking, and there's still so many things I want to do.

Edited by member 14 Jun 2023 at 00:03  | Reason: additional info

User
Posted 14 Jun 2023 at 10:50
You write so eloquently about your situation that it always brings a lump to my throat but you really do inspire a lot of us and you have created memories that will last a very long time.

I did have a crazy thought and I have no idea of your situation, but my wife and I have been lucky enough to travel to many places, including a long period travelling throughout the USA. However, between her medical situation and mine and limited funds, we are never likely to be able to repeat this and so I started dabbling with Virtual Reality and purchased a pair of Meta Quest 2 VR headsets. One of the free apps is called 'Wander' and it's basically Google Street View in 3D - it's literally like being there and you can look around in all directions and travel the roads, not only of places that we have been and have such happy memories of, but also places that we have wanted to visit but never did.

It means that we can sit in our chairs and visit almost anywhere in the world in 3D.

It might be something that you would enjoy given your lack of mobility and you honestly don't look the slightest bit silly wearing them - honest :) :)

Take care and our thoughts are with you.

User
Posted 14 Jun 2023 at 18:30

You are indeed a very Brave man DeanA and I can’t tell you how much your posts touch me.
To be able to talk openly about your situation shows so much courage and my thoughts are with you.

Derek

User
Posted 14 Jun 2023 at 19:23

Hi DeanA,

I'm so very sorry to hear of your situation.  I hope you can achieve full relief from pain and that you get to potter about in your garden, which might bring some measure of contentment.

Best wishes,

JedSee.

User
Posted 14 Jun 2023 at 22:09

Dean,

Been following your story for a while.

Difficult to say the right words but you are an inspiration. 

I guess we would all like to think that we leave a 'legacy'. But you really have touched the lives of so many on here. 

Kindest of regards

Jim

User
Posted 15 Jun 2023 at 00:43
Oh Dean, I am so sorry to see this - and that the treatments have just not lasted out for you. Sometimes, younger men do seem to have a cancer which is so much more aggressive than normal. It is worth asking about Stilboestrol - considered an old-fashioned treatment nowadays s it is oestrogen-based but it does sometimes do the job that other HTs fail.

We are all willing you on - as an old friend on here used to say to other members when things were looking gloomy, "it's not over till the fat lady sings so we have locked her in the basement for you"

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 16 Jun 2023 at 08:26
Your posts have really touched me Dean, you are incredible. Difficult to say the right words, but hoping your pain can be controlled. Best wishes. X
 
Forum Jump  
12>
©2024 Prostate Cancer UK